Alice Darrow Interview - Tramps of the Apocalypse

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[00:01:43] The strongest steel is forged in the fire of a dumpster. It's a sentiment many of us can relate to in these uncertain and trying times. And I've got first time guest, Alice Darrow on with me to discuss how we can analyze apocalyptic wastelands in comics. Alice has a new three issue dystopian miniseries called Tramps of the Apocalypse dropping soon from Dark Horse Comics that follows the misadventures of three damsels causing much distress to a world set in 2094,

[00:02:11] ruled by Quest Ragnor, King of Males, as terrible dudes seek to do what terrible dudes would do in a scenario such as this. Alice, it's very nice to have you on the show. Thank you so much for having me. I'm so excited. Well, did you write the solicits for this? Because the description is so catchy. And the too sexy for chains line immediately set kind of this mental scene where right said Fred is singing.

[00:02:36] I'm too sexy, you know, for the inauguration of President Camacho and Eddie idiocracy, because that's what my brain just does. Yes, I did. I did write the solicitation. I wanted to be really nice. Big fan of Russ Meyer. So like I wanted to create, you know, that monologue at the beginning of Faster Pussycat Kill Kill. I was like, I kind of want the solicitation to be kind of corny, but punchy and silly. So yeah. Yeah. Nice.

[00:03:06] Well, I know you've been working on this for some time, as is the nature of comics, but it seems like the perfect time to drop some more social satire, although maybe it seems too tragically real about now. Where was your brain at when you started Tramps? When I started working on this comic for Dark Horse, it was during the election cycle. And I kept thinking like, wow. 2016. No, this was 2025.

[00:03:35] Like this was I started drawing this like the first issue June of 2024. So, oh, wow. OK. Yeah. Things were really starting to pick up. And I kept telling myself like, oh, my God, like if Trump wins, how am I going to keep working on this? And so, of course, when Trump won, it was really, really hard for me to get back into.

[00:04:03] I had to take a little break because it was so I mean, it wrecked me. And eventually I had to force, you know, I had a deadline, right? So I had to kind of force myself back into it. And I just it actually kind of felt good because I was making fun of all of these like incels and kind of manosphere type of men. And so weirdly, it kind of I thought it was going to be really hard for me. And it ended up being kind of a life raft.

[00:04:31] And it's still in many ways is a life raft for me. I'm drawing issue three right now. So, yeah. OK, so you were able to find some solace in the humor you were able to infuse into the project then? Yes. I've always felt like when times are tough, I have always looked to humor. OK. You helped me get through it. And so I hope my comic kind of brings that to people.

[00:04:59] I know drawing it, it has definitely brought a little bit of hope and joy in my life, I would say, during these challenging times. Yeah, yeah. I mean, I was talking to my wife the other night and kind of using the illustration that if aliens came down to Earth, what would the intelligent species be that they would first try to interact with? And we were coming up with cetaceans like dolphins and whales and ants and elephants and bees.

[00:05:28] And it came up and I pointed out what they all have in common, which is a matriarchal system. So that was my filter when I was reading through the advanced copy the other night. And I was thinking, is the message for trams as simple as death to the patriarchy? I think obviously that's a message.

[00:05:51] For me, what was really important is also to kind of make fun of these stereotypes that we have to set like the way we view men and women. Even, you know, we have this character called Cecil, who's like, it's kind of considered like a lesser man because he's softer and doesn't really correspond to like these values of patriarchy. I mean, right. For me, it was really like.

[00:06:18] Even these three ladies like there, each one is like a stereotype of like the heroine, you have like the smart one, the like angry one, the like pretty but careless one. So that was kind of a and these are also stereotypes we see a lot like in comic books, especially with like kind of girl boss, like kind of feminism, which we'll see in Marvel movies. So that was kind of my inspiration and where I wanted to go with that. OK, yeah, it's a really bold book.

[00:06:48] I'd even call it a bit confrontational. You know, it it challenges that modern male ego in a really effective way. You got ED medication, small guns is a metaphor for small other things. Modern men embracing Viking culture, you know, trying to find, I guess, brotherhood and sense of purpose. Religion used as a control mechanism.

[00:07:10] And my personal favorite was Ragnar's underwear locket with a heart and a keyhole as if sort of the male phallus is something only to be bestowed on the lucky or the worthy. It is. This is not a reserve portrayal, Alice, at all. Well, you know, it's funny because there's like a trend of like men who are like unvaccinated, not wanting to sleep with vaccinated women. And that was so weird. Right. It's it's so stupid.

[00:07:39] I saw someone from the Manosphere the other day be like. Be careful sleeping with vaccinated women like they could pass the vaccine on to you. So there is like I mean, there's so much absurdity out in the world. And I think that like especially women like we get made fun of so much and we just kind of have to take it. And there's this. Yeah. Now there's this thing of like, oh, we can't be funny anymore. We can't laugh.

[00:08:07] And yet when you make fun of a man in any capacity, it's like a tragedy. I mean, when you see like Elon Musk saying empathy is a weakness and then, you know, you say one bad thing about him and he's like. Oh, don't be. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Yeah, it's it's wild. I don't know what socials you're on that you're seeing this. That doesn't come across what I'm looking at quite as much, but maybe that's because I've tuned it off and I'm not on X or anything like that anymore.

[00:08:38] I'm not on X. My husband is so sometimes like he'll you know, he tells me like. X is just the cesspool, like it's horrible. And then on Instagram, for some reason, like I get mostly left wing and liberal content, but occasionally. I'll get like a lot of Christian and like manosphere stuff. It's very weird. I wonder if it's because I did so much research for this book.

[00:09:05] They're kind of the algorithm is kind of confused whether. Yeah, yeah, that makes a lot of sense. Well, with the three heroines, you have baby and Bella Donna. And by that, and you spoke to some of the different traits that you wanted them to have. And they also have very distinct looks. It came off as presenting, you know, widespread expression of of female presentation. You know, it was really important to me.

[00:09:32] I think I've had this debate pretty much like ever since college with my professors, like how we portray women and the fact that men, you know, obviously sexualize women a lot in their drawings. And my goal has always kind of been to take that back because I'm apologies. My cat is interfering. My goal has always kind of been to take that back. I don't think that there's anything wrong with female bodies and it.

[00:10:01] I don't know, I wanted to draw a bunch of different, not necessarily like in the stereotypical. I mean, in many ways, like they're very voluptuous. They're very beautiful. They're very beautiful. But they're also like, you know, sometimes they like the drawings are a little I try to make them look realistic in their, you know, in their bodies. I try to kind of infuse it with the female gaze as much as possible.

[00:10:24] So that I avoid, you know, hyper sexualizing them in a very like male centric way. It's interesting having done the women in comics feature that I did in March because it brought to light holes in a way of interpreting silhouettes for me and as a man in a very different way.

[00:10:48] And how you you can use them presenting differently and how that works to create positive image results. So hair seems to be a like a big thing, how hair moves, which is not something I really thought about that much previously. Yeah, it's true. I actually I thought about the hair a lot while designing these characters.

[00:11:13] I mean, baby is like an obvious reference to Chura Satana who's in faster pussy guy who I love. I think she's this incredible, credible person, very fun, very smart. I, you know, I wanted them all to look completely different and have their own kind of identity through their hair also because I play with black a lot like, so I had a lot of fun and I had a lot of fun with that for sure.

[00:11:44] And I don't know that there are details that men necessarily notice, but I think that I'm hoping like right, you know, I'm hoping people will will start to take notice of things. You know how I I also did something like in the three issues that's kind of silly, but kind of a nod to that is like they always have a different outfit in each issue.

[00:12:08] And you'll you'll see that it doesn't really make any sense considering the story and kind of what transpires having fun with those things. Well, that power trio is part and parcel of a solid female team. We see it all the time. Charlie's Angels, Powerpuff Girls, Hidden Figures recently or Steel Magnolias if we want to take it back to a more classic reference. What made three the compelling protagonist number for you for that?

[00:12:37] That's a good question. I think. For me, I thought in terms of the personalities and how they interact with each other and also like it was really important and I kind of based these I won't really wanted to base this dynamic, which again is really close to faster pussycat kill kill, which is that you have two characters that are kind of close.

[00:12:58] And then you have a third one that is kind of on the outs, which, by the way, they explain in something like White Lotus and it works very well because usually three people is a disaster. Three women together. We there's some conflict.

[00:13:12] And Bella Donna was a really important character because I also think like, especially with the results that we saw about like White women being kind of like ambivalent to politics sometimes or even joining white cis men and voting for Trump. Like it was really important for me to kind of like, oh, this white woman in this comic is like doesn't feel like she's that affected by what's going on.

[00:13:41] So three just it seemed like it was going to create a lot of interesting conflict and tell kind of three different stories of female empowerment. Hopefully that answers your question adequately. Yeah, no, it does. I always go back. I guess I can't escape it whenever we're talking about women.

[00:14:01] I will always go to matron mother crone as the opposite of the male holy trinity where we're using religion to illustrate the son, the father and the Holy Spirit and as a representation of patriarchy. So that's kind of where all I remember my brain always kind of gravitates to that that concept. Oh, interesting.

[00:14:24] You know, it's funny that you mentioned like the Holy Trinity also because I'm kind of a huge inspiration for this is also this. You know, there's like this infamous picture of it's like it's Britney Spears. I think Lindsay Lohan and Paris Hilton and they're like in a car and it's like, oh, the holy trinity. And so I kind of I remember seeing that being that is so funny.

[00:14:51] And that's like what these women kind of their, you know, kind of are of that. OK. No, it does. It actually brings back memories. I actually work for Britney Spears, so I have I have more reference than most people do. I but yeah, I really love that because I I also tried to put a bunch of different references, especially from, you know, pop culture kind of girly pop, girly pop. Yeah.

[00:15:20] Just because I also feel so much like anything that is. Feminine is considered so dumb and useless. I mean, this is going to I don't want to go on a rant about Legally Blonde. No, go ahead. Legally Blonde is a really good example for me of a movie that is really modern in its take on feminism and that has really inspired me. And it's kind of considered like, I mean, up till now, I think people are starting to, you know, see it for what it is.

[00:15:47] But for the longest time, like, oh, that was a dumb chick flick. Whereas like no one's going to go, you know, what's that? No one's like Fight Club is a is a dude flick. And I kind of see it as that. Oh, it's a dude flick. Palahniuk in general is a dude writer. Dude writer indeed. And there's, you know, there's nothing wrong with that.

[00:16:12] But I find that there's so much condescension in regards to anything that's a little bit too like pink and femme leaning.

[00:16:22] Yeah, it's interesting to see how Legally Blonde being a little bit older now and how girls growing up now will perceive Barbie as one of those milestones when when they hit their late 20s or early 30s and how well that dates because everything changes. I mean, my relationship with when I was younger, I was on the road working for rock bands. Palahniuk was probably my favorite writer.

[00:16:52] You know, it was a hyper masculine air time in my life personally. I mean, I wasn't a dick dude, but, you know, different time periods in our lives will resonate in different ways. So it's just very interesting to hear about some of those influences of yours and how they're affecting something really, which is fairly recent.

[00:17:17] If you just just started this as sort of a response to this Trump go around, because I remember my response to the last Trump go around. Well, I mean, I also did a lot of work like I mean, I did a lot of more political. I was in college during his first his first term, and I remember doing a lot of things of kind of that nature. But I didn't come up with this idea until later.

[00:17:43] And I think by, you know, I mean, I think we're still kind of talking about him by the time I graduated and first had this idea. Yeah. But, you know, it's funny when I was little, I was not allowed to have Barbies. My mom was very against them because I do think that there's a generation of women that, you know, if you wanted to survive in the workplace, like you couldn't really be feminine and you couldn't you couldn't be femme. It just was not accepted.

[00:18:10] And so I do think now we're seeing like, hey, I can actually like Barbie and think things and be very feminine and be good at my job and I should be accepted into my workplace. No matter who I am and what I like. So. Which, of course, as we see, upsets. This current administration very much. Yeah. Well, I was curious about this. Finishing up the the women in comics feature in March that I did.

[00:18:39] It certainly gave me a better perspective of the challenges of women and femme presenting creators in the medium. And as your own first big comics debut in the US with with with tramps, I can't help but think there's at least some part of it that channels your own journey in this classically male dominated industry. Or are you? I mean, I don't want to I don't want to put a filter on that. Like, I don't want to be the guy who's speaking too much. No, no, not at all.

[00:19:08] You know, I did struggle a lot and I I struggled. Quite significantly in college with some of my professors. I mean, I'm pretty lucky in that, like, Dark Horse has been really kind to me. I I've enjoyed the like I'm so just for some context, I'm half French, half American. So I went to college and France and I spent a great part of my life in France.

[00:19:36] And one thing that I love about the US is that there is a level of professionalism that doesn't exist in France. And I worked on a book before I started on tramps. I was. I was. An extremely sexist editor who essentially anytime I asked a question.

[00:19:58] It was not possible I was being bratty and difficult no matter what I did if I did not kind of conform and just say yes to everything. It was going to be a huge problem. And he it ended with a very aggressive email basically telling me I was a diva. And so which, you know, I'm still a little upset about.

[00:20:23] But so when I landed at Dark Horse, I was kind of like, oh, wow, everyone is being so professional and no one is insulting me and treating me like like I'm an idiot. But but yeah, I I I struggled on that project quite a bit. I was also my mom was the writer on it. And so I think it was difficult for her to she's older and, you know, obviously, and was in the film industry like in the 70s.

[00:20:50] So I think she was a lot more accustomed to this kind of treatment. But when I was in college, something I really struggled with is that. The way I drew women was so hyper analyzed and I would see men do these hyper sexualized drawings of men of women, and it would always be like, oh, well, that's normal for him. But we're going to scrutinize your work.

[00:21:20] But he gets to do whatever he wants. The amount of men that took projects for me. And again, the administration is always like, well, you know, you got to get used to it. That's just how the art world is. And so we like perpetuate this cycle of like making life as difficult as possible for female, female and female presenting creators is just it is really tough.

[00:21:44] And I think it would be really hard to find someone who hasn't run into that kind of shenanigan. So I call it. Yeah. All right, everybody, we're going to take a quick break. We'll be right back. Let's face it. The comics landscape is a mess right now. I'm the editor in chief of a comics journalism outlet, and I can't even keep track of it all. If you are as passionate as I am about indie comics and its creators, you should check out the Lantern Guide.

[00:22:10] Created on the premise of creating light in the dark, it's going to be the go to resource to keep you up to date on the projects and the creators that you love. Don't take my word for it. I reached out to my friend Brian Lovell, Poison Ivy artist and indie comics creator to get his take. Brian, what does the Lantern Project fix? I'm a dude who loves indie comics. And I know personally, like I get very frustrated when something shows up in my social media timeline or something like that.

[00:22:37] And I feel like I can't keep track of everything. So really the Lantern Project was born out of that. It was an opportunity for me as a reader to kind of like have a place to want to consolidate all the stuff that I wanted to read. All the cool projects from cool creators that seemed interesting and kind of unique to like something that I would like, which is really not super represented everywhere else, but it's all over the indies.

[00:23:01] Having a spot to go to that felt like it consolidated a lot of those audiences and a lot of those places where I couldn't just get drowned out in the feed of social media seemed really valuable to me. What's the ultimate goal? It's really our hope with this project that creators feel like they're able to get in front of readers and readers are able to get books that they actually want to read with a much easier time of keeping track of them. And accessing them.

[00:23:29] The catalog is scheduled for a quarterly release, so head over to thelanterncatalog.com to sign up now so you don't miss your next favorite thing. I'll put a link in the show notes for you. Y'all, Jimmy the Chaos Goblin strikes again. I should have known better than to mention I was working on my DC Universe meets Ravenloft hybrid D&D campaign on social media. My bad. He goes and tags a bunch of comics creators we know, and now I have to get it in gear

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[00:24:49] I think I'm going to make Jimmy play a goblin warlock just to get even. Welcome back. I don't think I've talked, I certainly didn't in March, but somebody from your perspective more who's just starting out. The people I interviewed have been in the business for a while. So what is your take on how we fix it? How do we change and create more opportunities for women in common? That's a difficult, difficult question. I know it's a big one.

[00:25:19] It's a big one. I think, I tend to think everything starts with education. I think a lot of girls get into school and they're kind of immediately discouraged. And I think, you know, when you look at the demographic in art schools, it's mostly women. And then the art world is mostly men. And you got to wonder how that happens. And I think it's, you know, they're discouraged.

[00:25:49] They're constantly being put down. I mean, the amount of times, like I said, I got a project just completely plagiarized and the response was, well, you better get used to it because that's how it's going to be. We also create bitter people. I've run into some women who are in their 50s and who think that every young girl should, like, should meet the same fate as them and suffer just as much. And that's just not the way.

[00:26:17] So I think it does start with, you know, schools and making sure we're just as encouraged and we're, we get the same opportunities. Yeah. And also something I noticed is that whenever you pitch anything that has a more femme edge, the response is always like, what about the boys? And we never, ever ask, what about the girls? And we are like a huge demographic, by the way.

[00:26:46] Like, as we saw with Barbie, like, we pay money to see these things and to read these things. Exactly. Yeah. Um, men aren't the old, like straight cis men aren't the only ones, you know, buying comics and going to the movies. So. Yeah. So is, is form language part of the challenge as, as an artist?

[00:27:12] Um, and, and, and something that you have encountered where I'm trying to draw something and in more of a, a femme. Presenting or femme positive way. And that alone creates a barrier that a male artist would just, if they did essentially exactly the same thing. Is anybody going to question that? I mean, I think audiences will question that, but I think like, I mean, I think now we have people react, they see something,

[00:27:41] they see something, you know, racist, homophobic, trans, but like they say something. But I do think that like, um, there is still a certain generation, like in, you know, studios. I also talk about, I work in animation. So it's something I, I have seen. Um, and I've seen with my dad too, who's, who's in the industry. Um, I do think people of a certain generation, like they do put a roadblock on that, uh, quite, quite quickly.

[00:28:10] Um, I, I mean, I hope it's getting, I think it's getting a little bit better. I'm, I mean, it's hard to tell with this administration, cause it seems like everything is in a backslide. Um, but when I see something like the substance for, I know this isn't comics, obviously, but I think, oh, actually like there's a shop, like someone let this woman make this movie. That's, that's incredible.

[00:28:38] Well, in terms of legacy, you just mentioned your dad and he's one of those cult comics royalty figures, probably the most famous for Shaolin cowboy, which is a martial arts epic itself in the desert. Whilst fighting fascist. So apparently that's something that might be in the genes. I've talked to a few other women who are carving out their own careers, kind of beneath the shadows of famous fathers, you know, in some cases, famous grandfather figures.

[00:29:05] So was this in a, in a way, a nod to, to his previous work, putting something in the desert fighting fascists? It, I didn't do it on purpose, but eventually when I got to the idea, I was like, Hey, this is a nice, this is actually like, I did kind of feel like I was following in his footsteps. Um, I also, I don't draw very many cards, like he inspires me very much to draw things out of my comfort zone, even if it doesn't always look good.

[00:29:35] I feel like I learned something, everything I draw every time I draw it a little more. Um, so it is a nod to him. I, it's difficult being the child of someone who is that talent. I mean, he is such an incredible illustrator. He can pretty much draw anything you can think of. Um, and I kind of didn't want to hide and pretend that, you know, I got her all on my own.

[00:30:00] I didn't have any, you know, uh, so I thought, you know, I'm going to lean into it. I feel really grateful that I had him, that I have him as a teacher. Um, so, and as a father. So, um, it did. And again, I have this great advantage that I can send him what I'm working on and kind of ask him for his opinion that I know he'll always be really honest with me.

[00:30:26] So I'm always curious to people when they grow up in kind of a more famous comics family, if it's, if it is something that is nurtured or more of a proximity learning curve, you know, if you, if you will, you know, you watch somebody work and then you're sort of copying them. It probably varies from family to family, but did, did you draw together? You know, what's, what's that relationship like? I mean, he, I remember being little and like, he would draw all the time.

[00:30:54] We'd go to restaurants and he'd draw, there's a really famous Chinese restaurant in Paris called Mirama. And he would draw on the, the like paper tablecloth. And so I grew up kind of watching him draw and being like, you know, he can just draw a dinosaur. Like, you know, there's a, there's a picture that I really love and it's of him and he's like using, I think it's like Crayola or like, and he's drawing on my arm.

[00:31:21] And so I think, um, like a lot of Nepo babies, you also grow up and are like, look at your parent, like, wow, they do such an ink. I want to do that too. Um, but he never ever pushed me. Wasn't like, you have to be an artist like me. He really was very nurturing and kind of let me do what I wanted to do. Um, and encouraged me once he realized I wanted to, to draw. Yeah.

[00:31:50] In my experience, artists, parents go in one of two vastly different polarized directions. It's either. Yes. I want to encourage you to be an artist, whatever artist that is, whichever medium. You choose. And they try to push them in that direction strongly. Or it's the complete other side of the coin where it's like, I don't ever want you to be an artist. I would go be a lawyer so you can actually make money. Yeah. Luckily he was very, he was like pretty mellow and supportive.

[00:32:19] And, um, I, there was a time in my life. I remember when I was trying to get into college for, he was like a little worried because I was quite a slacker in high school. I was not very good. Um, and he was kind of like, Hey, you're going to need that. Like you're, you know? Um, so he, but again, I had this advantage where like, he would force me to go to life drawing. Like if you want to make it in this industry, like you have to work really, really hard. And I, I really appreciated that. Yeah.

[00:32:49] Well, circling back to tramps, one of the things that I locked into and current currently topical for sure is fascism. Um, and this draws a pretty direct line. We have villains who are wearing KKK hoods or something approximating that the full on Nazi clone lookalike only without a swastika.

[00:33:10] And then you have quest Ragnar who looks sort of like Hulk Hogan is, is fascism easier to analyze with a more explicit approach like that, where you can easily pull in some iconography. Um, I think so. Yeah. I just, the thing is, I sometimes just feel things out and it, at the time it felt right for me.

[00:33:36] And you'll see as the show, as the like, comic continues, like sometimes I kind of dip in and out of that. Like sometimes they're just looking real goofy. Um, but they are goofy. Yeah. Yeah. They are real. I mean, that's part of the reason is like, cause it is very serious. And drawing, you know, a KKK hood and a Nazi uniform was a decision for sure.

[00:34:00] I did put them in booty shorts just because I, he's like wearing those boots and those booty shorts, just cause I thought that it, I don't know. It brought a little bit of extra kind of goofiness. Cause I think it would have been a little too terrifying to just have him like in a full Nazi uniform. Um, but again, it's also me very much making fun of fascists. I'm, you know, Jewish.

[00:34:27] So I, you know, it was important for me to put like a Nazi in there. Yeah. I have a, a personal beef where whenever we're displaying fascism, it seems like there is more. There's a prominence in terms of how it's viewed that's ascribed to, if you're trying to do something subtle and it's, it's, it's like subtlety all of a sudden. Oh, this is, this is mentally stimulating and challenging because it is subtle versus a more blunt approach.

[00:34:56] And I really enjoyed the, the blunt approach in this book. I thought it was very on point. Oh yeah. I, I like to be blunt and I do think like, I don't know. I, especially now we, I just feel like it's so in our face and there are still people who like refuse to see it. I think it's really important to like put the dots on those eyes. Like, like Donald Trump is the Nazi. Like I, I'm sorry.

[00:35:24] Like for me, there's, he's literally following that playbook and it's right. You know, there is no subtlety about it. And he says what he wants to do and he says what he's going to do. And it's incredible to me that people still like, we'll find a way to be like, well, you know, he talks a lot. You know, we still have that kind of boys will be boys approach where like his whole administration, you know, is kind of like Quest Ragnar and his like team of the boys. Who's goons. Yeah.

[00:35:54] It's not far from the truth, unfortunately. With like. Especially when. Yeah. Small things can do things like crash the global, you know, markets. because they don't know what they're doing like there's an incompetence there that i really wanted to make fun of in my comic but like they're idiots and it makes it even scarier and worse somehow

[00:36:19] it's what was that i think was it the guardian article was like i i always knew the world was gonna fall to fat like was gonna fall to like capitalist fascism i just didn't imagine like the men who do it would be such losers and i think that's so like that is exactly what i wanted to do with my with my book it's not all quite so overt you know you're peeling back layers

[00:36:45] of an onion in some ways with more subtly current stuff you have um at first i was wondering what your love of was volkswagens until i had that that moment the light bulb went off and i was like wait a minute volkswagens started and the origins there were the in the the german labor front you know which was the the national labor organization for the for the nazi party so i was like ding ding

[00:37:08] yes i did i mean i i also just like the design like it's for me it's always a mix of like intention and what i like to draw i try to find like a a good meeting point um i do like have a lot of happy accidents in there they're like a couple panels where you have like the hood of that kkk bad guy

[00:37:33] and then like in the panel over she's got her let like i think babette has relaxed in a triangle over him and it like forms a parallel of the hood i didn't notice i did that until later and i kind of when i was starting to design things i was like oh i'd like to draw volkswagen and then i was like wait a second that's perfect actually yep yep they're iconic and they're coming

[00:37:59] back i actually personally i would love to have one of those uh the vw buses the new electric ones those are awesome they're really cute and designed well they're they're really cool yeah they're amazing well another visual landmark that actually stood out for me was the color work in the book which i found pretty unique i don't believe i've seen anything quite like it if i'm interpreting it

[00:38:21] correctly because you're using a single color for detail sort of my maybe this is my age and my eyes are failing me but the the hue of it starts pink and as the book progresses it slowly kind of shifts into more of a lavender hue so is that accurate and if so why yes it is accurate and it actually will

[00:38:45] progress throughout the books you will see there is a color it you know my first instinct was like it needs to be pink because you know obviously i'm playing with all these stereotypes and um and my husband actually did the color for the book um because i knew i knew he would do exactly what i kind of what i wanted him to do and he'd have a bunch of good ideas and he he's calling it and he's

[00:39:10] like hey what if you know what would be even more girly pop if the color like changes so when you have the collection it's like a bunch of um so aesthetically um i've also always really struggled with how to color my work okay i'm not i'm not great at it um and there's just something about that that

[00:39:37] like i felt like he made my drawings look better i like the simplicity of it i also put so much work into the line art that it felt right to not have so much color in it and then at the same time again it kind of lended itself to this kind of aesthetic idea that i had i'm also like a huge fan of

[00:40:02] daniel claus and ghost world specifically and i just love the black with the singular color and so i kind of wanted to do my own version of that i dig it i thought you were going to say you were going in the direction of a trans flag and it would change throughout all of the books in that direction that you can take that you can say yes that's exactly what i intended to do

[00:40:29] but i'm happy that and actually what i think about it it does a hundred percent like i'm thinking about the colors in the rest of the book and yes um i did not do that intentionally but i am glad i'm glad that it came out that well coloring is more of a challenge for you what is your superpower as an artist i would say i i my first instinct was to say like my discipline i'm a very disciplined

[00:40:58] uh person i have like sit down i'm like you gotta draw five pages and i do it um i just that's a good question i it's a hard one it is a hard one i think i'm kind of good at drawing like disturbing things okay i would say discipline drawing disturbing things um and sometimes i come up with

[00:41:22] really silly visual ideas that make me laugh when i'm drawing them um i don't know if that is a good answer to your question no it's a very good answer because i look at the continuum in the progression of artists especially when you're coming from sort of working in another medium in your case this is the animation field and you're you've been working on big ips like futurama and disenchantment so that was

[00:41:48] kind of what i was curious about and picking with that because your your figure silhouette translation is really simple there's a really nice line economy to it that also speaks of a comfort level that you shouldn't have with your work at your age um it's it's really really good uh so i was wondering you know with that confidence and and working in animation how that made you a better

[00:42:16] comics artist you know coming from that background of doing specifically character design um well thank you very much i'm i get very self-conscious about my my drawing as i'm doing it right now like before i went into this interview i was like oh it's so bad thing i'm doing is so bad that's normal

[00:42:37] that's what i've uh been told but um animation i mean is especially where i'm working at rough drop studios which is kind of you know they hire young emerging artists which is really amazing uh they hired me right out of college um it is truly a boot camp for learning how to draw because okay you have to draw

[00:43:03] something that looks good with shape and not too much line and so you do learn how to be really um careful with which lines you choose to add because obviously someone's coming behind you and has to animate that i also learned a lot i mean i work with supervising directors who've been like in the industry forever and they're so helpful and they give me a lot of notes that i you know then take to

[00:43:31] comics i i get a lot of my inspiration also for the from the way that i like compose my pages from film and animation because i also like when i have time i'll look at the storyboards and i look at what the board artists do um i do think it's really important no matter what medium you're working in to kind of branch out as much as possible because you can learn so much from other um other mediums

[00:43:58] um and so i i feel like you know i feel incredibly lucky because i get to hone my skill every day as well and i draw eight hours a day yeah i was watching this thing um with vincent d'onofrio and he was i think it was at wonder con it was on tiktok where i found it but he was artfully dressing down a 20 something who is getting into the the artistic field and basically he's like i know i'm going to

[00:44:28] catch flack for this i know people complain but artists generally and i'm paraphrasing are lazy um and it seems like coming from the animation world that that's just drilled out of you deadlines are just what they are and there's this sort of a pipeline where you know there are people who are going to be doing this and this and this behind me so i've got to get this done and i got to let it

[00:44:52] go and in some ways i think that there's a freedom in that that a lot of artists who've come up in more traditional ways are always going to let that question oh this is not good enough so they just won't get it out you know that is such like a perfect observation that is extremely true and i you know my dad kind of told me that when i started out as well we're like sometimes you just gotta finish

[00:45:20] it i think the hardest part of doing any project is like doing the whole project the discipline that it takes to draw something or do something and like you hate it you hate it you're like oh this is such garbage but to keep kind of going and animation really did teach me that because like you gotta be fast and part of the reason like i'm good at deadlines and i can draw fast is because of

[00:45:46] animation and the philosophy i had when i drew this is like i knew nothing i did was going to be good enough for me and i just needed to do it and finish it and do my very best give it a hundred percent and i couldn't give myself the time to stop and think about it too much and kind of oh but i'm so am i good enough am i this am i that just i was like deadline that's why i kind of like deadlines as

[00:46:15] well it's good to know you got to be done at one point and you you don't have any other option well what is your ambition in comics what would you like to see your career start to become tramps is three issues let's say it's wildly successful and i truly hope it is because it's an excellent book and this gives you your your vaulting opportunity to move on and do other things what would you like to do i mean i would love to continue tramps to the apocalypse um because i did i do leave it pretty

[00:46:42] open-ended without spoiling anything um i also you know i would love to i have many other series ideas that i would like to do um i don't want to abandon animation because i love it very very much so i think i'd be very happy if i um was able to keep drawing my comic book and keep working in animation i i don't

[00:47:08] know i think that there's i'd be happy just if people were buying my book and i was able to make more um i'm lucky enough that i have a day job so i can kind of uh do this on the you know on the side and be able to live which i'm really really grateful for um that's kind of where i'm at right now yeah i i hope i'd like to get a series i'd like to end my because it's a long story that i have in my

[00:47:35] mind so i would love to uh be able to finish that up well i certainly hope you get an opportunity to you know my own personal take here after reading the first issue of transfer the apocalypse is it's it is definitely a biting if if cheeky satirical lens in the future we are precariously hurtling towards like a semi-truck going downhill with rather suspect brakes it also happens to simultaneously be quite funny and far too good to go under the radar so make sure you call your shop or order it

[00:48:05] online definitely gets my yeti stamp of approval alice where can people find you online uh you can find me on instagram at dallas d-a-l-i-c-e arrow a-r-r-o-w um and that is my only form of social media for now i guess you could also add me on facebook but i don't go on there very often um yeah i again please don't hesitate

[00:48:31] to follow i post a lot of memes and sometimes drawings as well and political commentary i think people got political commentary if they've gotten this far in the interview i also think they know what they're in for um i also sometimes do uh i am a fashion girly so sometimes i do you know runway reviews and that seem to me like quite popular and you know to me it's also part of comics and character

[00:48:58] design so if you're interested in all that you can follow me on instagram so do you have a lookbook of fashion stuff you're going to try to incorporate into future work then yes i have a i well their looks were very researched they're all wearing like i kind of tweak it to be a little more western but they're all wearing like any one of them's wearing some version of alaya i try to like infuse

[00:49:22] my personal hobbies into it yeah well as is a new tradition on the show i like to end the episode with a shout out to and and make it end on a positive note so this is a a shout out it could be a thank you it could be um something that inspired you recently and i'll go first to kind of take the pressure off and make it a little easier and give you a moment to think about mine is my dog

[00:49:47] uh lulu so yesterday i was having a really really rough day and as animals do they can tell when you're having that off day and so she came up and just started licking my leg and made me pay attention to her it's like hey hey i love you and whatever you're going through i'm really sympathetic to you i don't need to know the backstory or anything like that i just love you and see what's going on

[00:50:12] and i'm coming over here and acknowledging your pain and it made it so much better so shout out to lulu who am i gonna shout out i don't want to copy you and say my cap but i might have to but you can't that's fine i would like to special shout out to both of my cats who are terrors uh and they make my life very difficult sometimes but i love them so much and they make me laugh and um yeah i i feel

[00:50:41] very lucky to have them in my life and i'm glad i rescued them uh specifically my little douglas who was found in really rough shape i'm glad he gets to have like a life worry-free life living the living a luxurious existence so if i might what what was douglas the situation i'll give you i'm just curious because lulu we actually got from a well they call it a rescue that was in

[00:51:07] mississippi and they essentially had to rescue the dogs from the rescue because they were i'll spare everybody the grim details but they were in really really bad shape and when we got her she we had to nourish her back to health and she's got several broken ribs from clearly where she was struck in in some way that never healed right you know so they're sticking out on her side but she doesn't care she's

[00:51:33] happy and great and everything like that but i'm always curious about the the background stories about you know rescue animals because people love that kind of thing it's you know i got douglas um we already had our cat mimosahuela very much she's really smart and very evil um but we we were looking to get her little friend so we went to the burbank animal shelter and we saw this picture of a cat that

[00:51:57] was originally named taylor after taylor swift and he had a little nub of a tail um and he just kind of stole my heart and i found out that he had like they'd found him at the burbank mall and he i guess like his tail had been badly mangled and he was having like some eye problems um and it just makes

[00:52:19] me really sad that you know i hurting animals is disgusting and i will knock anyone out who hurts an animal especially like a kitten or it just anyways i uh he was in really rough shape and i'm really glad they were able to um bring him home and and give him some love and now he is a giant cat he weighs 15

[00:52:44] pounds and he's not overweight oh wow very big boy a hefty young man he's just big yeah we had a british blue when i was growing up named captain fuzz who was he was about that and he's probably actually about 16 pounds but he was he was something else man that cat would take on any dog in the neighborhood he was he was a badass cats will cats some cats are not afraid of dogs uh our miss mimosa like she

[00:53:12] hung out with my husband's parents dog and when he bothered her she just give him a smack did not care she ran the house yeah they do that cats don't play i said i i'm not a cat person these days as much um well because i'm highly allergic to them but we had them all growing up and yeah different personalities and they they add so much to our lives so yay we got to finish and give

[00:53:38] shout outs to to rescue pets everywhere so that feels pretty good that's a positive note for sure well alice thanks for coming on the show today and hanging out with me it's been a lot of fun thank you i had so much fun thank you for listening to me hopefully i didn't ramble or say anything too stupid no no you're great um thanks for coming on uh this is byron o'neill and on behalf of all of us at comic book yeti thanks for tuning in and we will see you next time take care everybody this is

[00:54:06] byron o'neill one of your hosts of the cryptic creator corner brought to you by comic book yeti we hope you've enjoyed this episode of our podcast please rate review subscribe all that good stuff it lets us know how we're doing and more importantly how we can improve thanks for listening