David Andry, Tim Daniel, & Marco Finnegan talk Morning Star

[00:00:00] Your ears do not deceive you. You've just entered the Cryptid Creator Corner brought to you by your friends at Comic Book Yeti. So without further ado, let's get on to the interview.

[00:00:30] Here is the Jaguar, the Hummingbird and the unicorn to defend the children from an ancient evil of haunts their nightmares. I got an advanced look at this and it blew me away.

[00:00:39] Artist Stefano Simeone is top level talent having worked on Mega Man, Radiant Black, and Star Wars among other things. And this is a perfect fit for a story that has something of a cross between so many of the team-oriented 80s cartoons I love.

[00:00:52] I interviewed David a couple years ago for his graphic novel, Finding Gossamer, and I've been looking forward to seeing what he does next.

[00:00:58] This has the look of something that will definitely get picked up by major publishers so get in on the ground floor.

[00:01:03] Head over to Kickstarter and search for Battle Mechs to sign up for notifications when this thing goes live.

[00:01:09] I've also dropped a link in the show notes to make it easy for you. It will be available in both English and Spanish which I absolutely love.

[00:01:16] This podcast has always been about promoting diversity, inclusion and comics and it makes it so much more accessible to a wider community of new younger readers.

[00:01:25] Don't miss it.

[00:01:29] Hello listeners welcome to another episode of comic book yet he's cryptic creator corner. I am one of your hosts Jimmy Gosparo

[00:01:35] and I have three creators that I am very excited to talk to today. And we are going to be talking about a new book from Mad Cave.

[00:01:41] You know how much I love Mad Cave and this is Morningstar.

[00:01:45] And I am welcoming back to the podcast David D.B. Andrew. You might remember his episode with Christopher Alvarez.

[00:01:53] We were talking about their crowdfunding comic dead blood which my brother Bobby the cryptic creator corner is number one most dedicated fan loved.

[00:02:02] I got him a signed copy and it was like one of his favorite things he was very excited to get it because even if 40 years old he is still he's 41 now.

[00:02:09] Very excited to get comics in the mail especially when they're signed and also I have co writer and Tim Daniel and artist Marco Finnegan.

[00:02:20] I am super excited to welcome everybody to the podcast David Tim Marco. Welcome to the comic book yet he cryptic creator corner.

[00:02:29] Yeah thanks for having us. Yeah.

[00:02:32] So I just want to jump right in because I have a bunch of stuff I want to try and cover but the long and short of it is with with Morningstar it tells like the opening story or the I guess like a kind of a cold open if you will it talk.

[00:02:48] The main character Nathan Garrett who is a firefighter in Montana 1956 and then it something happens to him in terms of getting trapped in a fire in the forest it cuts to that his family in the aftermath of that.

[00:03:06] And that's kind of what this first issue like dives into how does Joleen and he had two children Mara Beth and Charlie deal with the aftermath of this and they're kind of heading to a family event.

[00:03:19] To Morningstar look out and the whole first issue really really really sets sets the scene of this.

[00:03:29] And I love the first issue Marco I can't I want to start with you because I love the look of this book it set it set in 56.

[00:03:39] It feels like it with how the book looks and it's it's I kind of love.

[00:03:47] I don't know if juxtaposition is exactly the right word but the rest of the team Jason wordy's colors and Justin purchase lettering which is very, very modern.

[00:03:57] But I feel like your line work kind of has this like older 50 60 sci fi type of book look to it and I just blown away by it.

[00:04:07] Thanks man that's kind of I appreciate that's kind of my sweet spot like in terms of influences so it just kind of lined up that you know this book that Tim and I and David have been talking about for a long time fit that fit that sweet spot but that's kind of like where.

[00:04:22] I would say like 60 and 60 and back is my sweet spot of influences so it's nice to kind of play in that world and not feel like I'm.

[00:04:34] You know forcing something to look modern so I got to lean into that a little bit more and so thanks but Jason I think Jason is the cinematography hero of this thing man like what he did on top of that i don't think any of us could have predicted it like you know I like the line work and stories great.

[00:04:51] But that that Jason's colors are the frosting I mean that's something he went off on those so he gets he gets more credit because he had to fix anything I did wrong and then.

[00:05:03] And still make it look good so yeah now he's awesome but thank you.

[00:05:07] Yeah his Jason wordy's colors they yeah they are phenomenal I mean I really like the choices that he made in terms of when we're.

[00:05:14] In the beginning and then kind of transition to the home life and then whenever Charlie's in a panel and whatever exactly if we're in Charlie's like world or imagination there is a bit like the huge start to go towards more of like a yellow or green at times I thought I noticed and just yeah.

[00:05:36] Yeah I don't know about a whole thing he's like he's a cinematographer and the score of the whole thing to I mean if you.

[00:05:43] If you list like if you had to listen to his colors there they're pitch perfect where they're supposed to be like and I don't know honestly I'm curious how much Tim and David.

[00:05:53] And the editors chimed in on that or how much of that is just you know really strong instincts but I think if you ever want to know what a good color artist brings to your work that's a good example because if you compare the two.

[00:06:05] You know the story's still there and and a to be the sea still happens but it's like watching them move out the score you know like it's they just needs a little something and Jason you exactly what he was doing I mean really I couldn't have sat there and said how about you do this because I don't even understand how you did all that.

[00:06:23] Well that that is a good question mark and I know both David and Tim you've worked with Jason before I mean I know David definitely has yeah.

[00:06:33] Jason you know I love Jason I think he a genius and like the heavy lifting he did on resident is very indicative of the heavy lifting he does on this book you know.

[00:06:46] He he just adds such a unique element through his colors that he's really helping us tell a better story and it's it's additive it's not just it's not just enhancing Mark was already great art it's adding something to the book and like Mark said it's kind of like the soundtrack this is like you can.

[00:07:15] You can see when the mood is changing things start to shift through the color without even looking at like the line work or anything you know kind of like oh this is a tense moment this is a calm moment this is a family moment.

[00:07:29] You can tell us tell that through the color how he how he applies it to the page and the palette that he's using because he he is mimicking a lot of.

[00:07:40] Color techniques of the time you know with like it looks like the printing his offset like the color slightly misses the page the panels and and the type of fill that he's using on the colors I mean it's just it's just brilliant and I think it really.

[00:07:57] He makes it look like the book is of that time.

[00:08:02] Plus you know knowing that modern art Martin readers are going to be looking at this too so he has a foot definitely in both worlds and it doesn't it doesn't overpower like that's the tricky thing with what he does is that.

[00:08:16] Like it's really easy to like this is going so well let me let me throw more at it and he just he just knows that sweet spot that you know that I sat down and tried to.

[00:08:27] To plan that out for me would have been impossible I mean just I would have been like this is cool 100% more in ruin.

[00:08:37] Yeah I could see their you know especially because of how the story is is bookended with Nathan in the beginning and then where we see Charlie at the end there could definitely be.

[00:08:50] It could be a tendency with somebody else with not such a depth hand to like oversaturate like those panels into the book ends and Jason is not that way at all it's pitch perfect he's.

[00:09:04] He's a virtuoso I mean you know like if you look if you look at resident and then you look at Denison the book we did nightfall double feature evolve.

[00:09:13] And then you look at this you see an extraordinary range and what I mean by virtue also really is Jason's Jason sitting on.

[00:09:23] A graphic novel that is maybe one of the most stounding things I've ever seen and he did it all himself and if you can imagine the best.

[00:09:33] That we've seen i'm talking like Dave McKean i'm talking like David Mac I'm talking like every technique is employed and I've seen this thing and I could not even believe it you know like when someone tells you.

[00:09:47] You know in my spare time I paint portraits or I scale mountains and you just can't fathom how that work together that's Jason wordy team and you know marco is being very humble.

[00:10:00] You know if Jason's the virtuoso this is this man right here Marko finnegan is the man that was born to draw this book that's how this book works that's the foundation and you know that's where it all comes from.

[00:10:15] This is the guy that was born to draw morning star and when we were you know back away from when we were talking about this originally.

[00:10:23] There's no other way it made sense you know and here we are this this story has taken development over almost a decade and so here we are 10 years later and I think marco you've only refined yourself to the point where.

[00:10:42] The result now just speaks to itself it the proof is is those 22 pages that people are going to see an issue one.

[00:10:48] Well thanks no i'm it's a but again i guess right like it's like if some if you.

[00:10:54] I don't like if you if your favorite food is peanut butter and jelly and someone's like hey we want you to pay you to make peanut butter and jelly sandwiches eat them okay like.

[00:11:03] I guess i'll do pretty good you know i mean like it's it's not really like.

[00:11:08] Just looking at it and you know when we talked about characters eyes i mean i think 10 years ago we're like Steve McQueen and Mary Tyler more and we're like okay so.

[00:11:17] You know we're writing the same willhouse and then.

[00:11:20] At the time.

[00:11:22] Tim's like how old your kid at the time my kid who's now 18 was you know.

[00:11:28] The age of the boy in the book and he's like that's how old the boy is i was like sweet like you know.

[00:11:33] And thankfully i had another and another kid cycle through to be in the right dream so worked out.

[00:11:40] Good things to get delayed another 10 years yeah it would even think my grand kid or a neighbor kid or something so it worked out that my next son was you know.

[00:11:49] Was in there but then he had a gross for halfway through the book and i was like and so i got notes back and they're like he's really tall.

[00:11:56] I know it's a stop growing kid he did actually grow four inches my son Colton grew four inches for the time i started to book to the time i ended it and so i went back and look at the picture that was like i'm drawing an adult now.

[00:12:10] Yeah i mean on on almost every project i've been on there's either been multiple artists attached where you're like well this person could work or this person could work or this person can work.

[00:12:22] And with morning sards it was only just i mean it doesn't go anywhere without marco you know that's that's it it was the one.

[00:12:29] There's a one one artist that could do what we wanted to do on this book.

[00:12:35] And we'll speaking of the 10 years like so the materials that man cave sent over because they send over like a little you know nice little like press kit and they know in advance reader copy it seemed like.

[00:12:46] Did the idea start with you Tim and then you kind of slowly over the years brought people in like how did the actual development of this take place.

[00:12:56] The idea started and i'll say idea you know the idea started.

[00:13:01] Over a decade ago it moved around a little bit it found its way through two different publishers.

[00:13:09] And as marco knows you know there were times where I felt nothing was going to happen and then it felt like everything was happening.

[00:13:16] The dirty little secret here is that marco actually drew an entire first issue so there's two first there's two number ones maybe someday we do a lot of addition absolutely not.

[00:13:29] Yeah marco show.

[00:13:32] Well at least the finniggin cut and this is the fitting cut that that's I don't know that one I looked at it the other day and I was like maybe I can when we were drawing out like maybe I could recycle some stuff I was like no.

[00:13:45] That's a terrible idea 10 years of improvement huh yeah.

[00:13:50] It's you know that was it and then it then it went into a drawer and then along comes db entry to 2019 and we have our first kind of discussion about working together and you know.

[00:14:08] The idea went from an idea to a fully fleshed out family dynamic with characters that were fully realized that had a depth to them that they didn't necessarily have before to a dynamic that didn't wasn't as strong.

[00:14:22] And then you know ideas and possibilities I think the biggest thing that that db brought to this is the spirit of Charlie.

[00:14:31] He imagined things in ways I didn't and really you know I see a lot of people already identifying with Charlie I think they're identifying with db so you know he really brought this idea to full life and you know thank God thank God for mad cave really truly.

[00:14:53] Take a look at it and just just rolling right with it right away almost on site.

[00:14:58] Oh wow I read you know a couple of things that we're preparing for the interview that like some of the influences on this and Steven Spielberg and both you know Stephen King are mentioned and I mean the this the Spielbergness of it I kind of got like right away I feel like you know the build up of that issue the focus on the family for you know the.

[00:15:22] Family for you know those couple of pages that just that idea and I kind of think a Spielberg like family drama plus general like weirdness like some type of fantastical element there's something like you know when you think of like ET or you think of like close encounters or any of those things and you're talking about there's something else out there going on but at the same time we have characters who are dealing with either like.

[00:15:51] You know deeply personal relationship issues or some or loss or grief or some type of like you know tension and so.

[00:16:04] So is that something that everybody shares did somebody bring the Spielberg and somebody brought the Stephen King how does that work with the influences on the team I think just because I got to read the first script as I know that the Tim is the Spielberg.

[00:16:21] And DB brought the weird stuff.

[00:16:28] It was it was high concept before but then it got weird so that's a good that's a good indication of DB stuff.

[00:16:41] You know I'll say this you know there's some truth to that because DB always comes at things in ways I don't even I don't even conceive of he opens up so many possibilities in the process and that has been you know whether it's Morningstar or the additional books that we're working on or the books that we have worked on like end after in like Denison you know there's just possibilities I've never foresaw but you know each of.

[00:17:10] You know who doesn't at some point site Spielberg or site you know Stephen King sure they know it's kind of tried through I might even be a little tried at this point to say that but.

[00:17:22] You know for me like looking at like Stephen King the girl who loved Tom Gordon which is a simple story of a young woman who wanders off the path and is lost in a wood and you know she begins to dehydrate it she begins to loose.

[00:17:38] The horse then come forth those are the types of things that always make me most frightened when I as a reader and then DB seized on that and he started looking around sort of the natural environment that surrounds them in the Kootenie forest the Garrett family and that's where all this stuff starts cut loose.

[00:18:02] Yeah I mean I didn't have to do much heavy lifting as far as like you know plot and you know the starting point like like they said the whole first issue is there and it was you know pretty close to what is there again with some weirdness put in.

[00:18:22] So I got to focus on like family relationships and weirdness and you know making a little bit of spooky and having a nice.

[00:18:32] Interesting wrap up at the end I think that was kind of where I got to do some of the lifting but yeah it was so much so much was there already in you know they had all the characters they had.

[00:18:43] The setting they had a bunch of plot I'm like well this is freaking easy I don't have to do anything.

[00:18:51] Alright let's take a quick break.

[00:18:54] What in the Sam Hill is happening right now what is that?

[00:18:58] What is wrong?

[00:19:00] You like Bart?

[00:19:01] Yeah what is wrong?

[00:19:03] Oh you like band of Bart it's not my fault you muffle.

[00:19:07] Oh that makes sense they're dropping some great new series right now there's that one about a heavy metal guitarist in the 1970s with monsters working vast wizards.

[00:19:19] You know how we love monsters around here and my friend Dakota Brown he's working on a project.

[00:19:25] Grandma Tillies held tech mech with Lane Boyd I saw the preview for that that is crazy.

[00:19:31] Jimmy even contributed to their anthology from the static and had Matt Sumo on the podcast to talk about his project The Bardic Versus which makes a lot of sense that the project landed there.

[00:19:41] Where are you? Where can you find them?

[00:19:45] You need to get out there in previews or you can visit their website bandabars.com for all the latest.

[00:19:51] Can we turn the music off now?

[00:19:53] Oh yeah!

[00:19:55] Thank you no more surprises, menstruals or anything like that or I'll rent you out to the rim fair as a children's ride.

[00:20:01] Let's get back to the show.

[00:20:05] And in terms of the script with like you know, but you know David both you and Tim being credited as like co-writers.

[00:20:13] Is it like each each of you take a pass or I've talked to other co writers before and like somebody will write up to a scene somebody will take a particular portion of it.

[00:20:21] Or does somebody tackle the story and somebody scripts it like how does that work between the two of you?

[00:20:27] Well it's a bit of slightly slightly different but mostly the same with every project.

[00:20:33] Something like this Tim already had a full basic outline you know with maybe some like and then we'll figure out the ending later kind of stuff.

[00:20:41] So the outline was already there and the first script was already there so I just went through and just started rewriting everything.

[00:20:53] And so what we usually do in our process is that we'll either talk stuff out or Tim will outline something and then I'll do what we call a vomit draft which is just a straight like a script without panels and pages but all the dialogue and stuff and all the action is in place.

[00:21:13] But I don't really pay attention to like oh this is a double page spread this is whatever it's just this happens as person says this this happens as person says this.

[00:21:22] And I get the as much of that as I want to get done either an issue or two issues or three issues set it back to Tim.

[00:21:32] He'll do his pass on that same thing in almost the same format and then usually sends it back to me and I'll do it as a script break it into an issue or two issues or whatever and then send it back to him and he does his pass in a script form.

[00:21:49] So it kind of works like that like I write a bunch of stuff send it to him he fixes it and then sends it back to me I write a bunch of stuff he fixes it and sends it back to me but usually Tim is much, much better at outlining and coming up with ideas.

[00:22:08] It's just sitting on a desk coming up with ideas and this is how the story is going to go.

[00:22:12] And then if we get a second one, this is how that one's going to go and then the third book is going to be like this and then you know 20 years down will still be doing the same comic and I basically can see about five feet in front of me.

[00:22:25] And I go okay let me just start writing because we're talking about this at another series that we're working on right now is like I could not get my head around it and Tim's like no it's like this and this I'm like okay I just can't get it.

[00:22:42] So I just had to write the whole thing and I just had to write it till I got to the end and then I could understand the end and then I'm like okay now I've got it you know I'm definitely from the Stephen King school of writing where you don't do a whole bunch of outlining and stuff you just kind of sit and start going so I kind of have to write it to see it and a lot of times Tim can see the whole thing in a second and then give me the gist of it.

[00:23:09] Here's a little DB story from this past week new project that we've been working on and I send him a script version whatever.

[00:23:18] And he we get on the phone real quick because we always check in with each other when we make a move you know and it's like okay the script is coming and he goes wait there's a script did I give you a script I was like you gave me the entire series you gave me the entire series that's every script for every issue already.

[00:23:39] He's like okay okay well then how much to do.

[00:23:44] Yeah I told Jimmy earlier my memory was garbage and it's like yeah I forgot I forgot I wrote five issues.

[00:23:52] You know it's becoming an organic process because that's the kind of thing is this DB just described you know he took Morningstar and worked from that initial script that went through two different iterations there's a 30 page version of it so.

[00:24:08] Someday when we release the finniggin cut we're going to include the 30 page script from TV so you know that you know he.

[00:24:21] Not only did that but then he did the entire series all the way out so you know the wonderful part about that is in the processes that gives us the ability to sit down together and see it.

[00:24:37] See it all and look for the possibilities look for the opportunities and then really begin to work almost backwards forwards at the same time and that's really.

[00:24:48] And I really have to get I had to get into it I have to sit I can't you know Tim once Tim gets the name of a character of a character of a character he knows that character I have to get their voice I have to write them for a while I have to have some interaction I really love dialogue I love get.

[00:25:06] Into the dialogue and so that's when my first pass is like I get all the dialogue in there and then I can really understand the character a lot of times that dialogue doesn't change that much past through past through past even though like we may even delete the whole scene with that dialogue that seems still existed.

[00:25:27] And because that's that's what it takes for me to understand like what the characters are going to do how they're going to make their choices what their attitude is is really just getting there and writing them a little bit.

[00:25:40] Yeah Tim does your process change at all like working with different co writers I mean you also for any listeners I'm sure I've talked about it on the podcast before especially I've interviewed Josh Hickson but the plot is one of my.

[00:25:55] Favorite favorite favorite comics of you know the past few years so like working with somebody like Michael Maurici is your is that process different than working you know with with David yeah vastly I mean and and.

[00:26:12] That was a more regimented process.

[00:26:16] DB and I are just it's just a much much more organic.

[00:26:24] And much it feels like neighborly like meaning if if DB lived next door to me I would just go to the fence and say hey you know we're going to cut down that tree and put up a you know put up a hot tub you want to come over and have a barbecue and then bring the family or that kind of thing it's very it's very much like a conversation and it happens at any time.

[00:26:45] All the time you know and so it's it's markedly different.

[00:26:51] We're at and sorry Tim I think of it kind of like you know if you ever sat around with your friends said what it wouldn't you know wouldn't be cool if like.

[00:27:01] Hope thought you know the invisible woman or something and you come up with this and then this could happen all that would be cool to this happen and it's just this kind of natural play off each other that's kind of how it is we just kind of riff off each other.

[00:27:16] And until we start really hone in on like something that connects with us emotionally connects with us like on a deeper level than oh I like that let's go that direction.

[00:27:28] And so yeah a lot of the stuff comes just through talking conversation and then.

[00:27:33] You know cool you know cool ideas that we want to focus it on yeah it seems like it might be tough to like if you have co-writers who are worked on other series before to kind of.

[00:27:44] You know have that same collaboration or camaraderie when you know somebody else enters the fray like you know Marco but it sounds like Marco just fit.

[00:27:53] Like right in with the group with this series I mean I've only read issue one and I'm just like.

[00:27:58] You know I'm I've already he praise on it I mean it just seemed like the three of you and you know with Jason and especially you know Justin Birch as well it seems like they're you know haven't been too many bumps in the road with that with this collaboration.

[00:28:12] I mean Marco's a pros pro Marcos professional he's a busy dude so he has time to mess around and be precious he's like I'm going to kick ass on these pages and and that's going to be it and so it's like.

[00:28:26] Yeah do him again he's a bit of a machine no so yeah I mean definitely Marcos making a lot of choices and stuff I don't think we gave a ton of direction.

[00:28:38] I mean our scripts are pretty thorough but I mean definitely you're seeing a lot of Marcos choices in the pages and what's nice about the stuff is I don't I don't ever mind notes or edits I think it I like I don't think I'd be like some but I don't.

[00:28:53] I don't take it personally you know I don't think it's a front and all their notes and edits that we that came through were all like acting notes or you know consistency notes things that.

[00:29:03] I think and that goes a lot to our editor to because he's fantastic but I think a lot of it is just how do we make this.

[00:29:10] How do we make it all sing like so it all works together so there was notes for like you know emotionally maybe she wouldn't.

[00:29:17] That beats not reading you know the acting on it and so those are notes that you don't get a lot of because a lot of times people don't.

[00:29:23] Hey attention to it it's kind of the action notes you get or the.

[00:29:27] The like just a to be the sea but not the emotional notes so emotional notes are fun to get because it tells you that you're kind of on the same wavelength and it gives you a little bit something more to work with.

[00:29:38] And you know there's some heavy acting scenes in this and so.

[00:29:42] You know we want to make sure that we're hitting those beats but no I think it's I you know these guys are fantastic and it's funny because there's.

[00:29:49] The way that they describe their relationship is that's the personalities that they are like Tim is height like Tim like like you don't go you don't go walking around a convention floor with Tim because he's like you need that you need that 300.

[00:30:03] $300 John Ramita strip ways are you know you deserve it you earned it and I'm like I don't know you deserve it yeah I know what you talking about you know what I'm talking about too.

[00:30:17] Yeah I can tell from his face yeah exactly no you know I'm not going to do it.

[00:30:25] And I opposite like I did that I did that to Tim I Tim Daniel Jim with the mobile violobos cat well yes good I didn't buy that and I still have I still wake up and cold sweats because I was like damn it Tim said you deserve that.

[00:30:41] And and DB's the opposite DB you're like I get this and he's like do you want it I don't know that's it you're like okay.

[00:30:53] I guess I'm not getting it like you know so it's very they're very much you know angel and devil on your shoulders and that's how it's it's how they write like you know like once like Tim super hype and and sometimes if you're talking to DB you're like you know this is super excited like okay.

[00:31:10] But Tim again like to be like I don't know that's a good idea that's the best idea ever.

[00:31:17] So you know like there it's it's really symbiotic to be around them because they keep you grounded and I and I can't tell where the notes are coming from you know they're very similar in tone as far as story goes and

[00:31:30] I don't think there's two writers that write more heart than these guys and that's you know high concept stuff you everything is a high concept IP something that someone's going to try to sell an epilogue but.

[00:31:41] The emotional stuff in this was the fun and the challenging part because they really you know they either put a lot of themselves or I know Tim put a lot of his family into it.

[00:31:51] And I put some of my you know things that my kids do and it's kind of like one of those things we're encouraged to do where a lot of time to work with people and it's like you feel like you're drawing what they would draw if they could draw you know I mean like it's it's very much like no no do it like this or no no do it like that.

[00:32:08] And it's almost like you're just the hired help and on this one it was very it was very you know supportive and like you know was messed around and there was notes and sometimes if I didn't agree with the note or I didn't understand the note the clarification was all is there and it was never like.

[00:32:24] It was never like no this is how we want it and I could easily get out voted because you know i'm doing the math I could get out voted.

[00:32:32] Anna but it was never like that so it's a great you know hopefully we'll do more down the line.

[00:32:38] Definitely now go ahead Tim.

[00:32:41] I just yeah I just you know the story that Marco shared you know that dates back almost a decade right and I think what made this so wonderful is that because there was that foundation to work from

[00:32:54] and when we really started in earnest with Matt cave on Morningstar that investment was like the investment was already established right like we're collaborators were co-creators were not hired hands were not you know this is a team

[00:33:11] and that was something that dated back because the same thing for DB and I that same convention that I walk the floor at San Diego with Marco that's you know one of the first times I ever met David so like that investment data back coming to it now that was easy to work from right that was a that was a seamless process really you know and having James Bennett or James M James B. M are editor that mad cave you know he keeps things

[00:33:40] very even killed he's very fair and balanced in terms of you know presenting ideas and presenting notes to us so that when we're you know framing them back to Marco we've examined all the possibilities maybe grown another one out or said no let's disregard that leave that as it wonderful you know so

[00:34:02] just makes it a really nice smooth process and I think James had a big hand in guiding that yeah at a lot of the very tall I met him yeah and very and very handsome too he's very handsome yes and the cool like what I loved about what I love about James no it's sometimes he'll say things like this doesn't seem like this work

[00:34:27] and and maybe let us come up with a solution to it you know he's not he has very very very light handed he's willing to be outvoted but he also is going to say why he thinks something doesn't work so I mean it's a really

[00:34:45] very pleasant editorial experience I don't feel like I there's any overriding of my ideas or our intention on the book and he's just there to support the book and make sure the book looks the best it could look and reads the way we want it to read.

[00:35:05] He's a huge cheerleader too I mean anything you do like you know you send him anything and it's like.

[00:35:12] Yeah I feel I sent you know stick figure thumbnails and I'm like he makes you feel like it's the best thing you ever drew like yeah he's like I love these I was like you can understand this.

[00:35:24] You can find them back to me because I don't remember what they were.

[00:35:27] Marco to get back to something you had said in terms of the the acting in the book I like I wanted to point out a couple of things that really stuck with me like when I read it and the

[00:35:41] Jolene is arguing with her sister and like the last panel where the sister kind of like I don't know if she's looking down or like pinches the bridge of her nose and the look that Jolene gives her I mean

[00:35:54] That is so good like you know exactly what is going on in that dynamic between the two of them I just felt that that like

[00:36:04] Nailed it in terms of the acting in those two poses and that really stood thanks. Thanks man I appreciate that that's again that kind of of the era like you know I'm a big

[00:36:16] Leonard star fan who did Mary Perkins on stage which is like just a soap opera drama

[00:36:22] And so you don't get an opportunity to do things like that a lot you know like it's kind of and that's again goes back to the guys where they're

[00:36:31] They're not hitting you with you know panel panel of exposition and action like they're letting those little moments breathe

[00:36:38] And then thankfully I got you know all my kids are theater kids so I got all these melodramatic actors around my house all the time. Okay

[00:36:46] As speaking as a theater kid watch it

[00:36:49] Hey

[00:36:51] I got I got a kid at university for writing and directing theater another one is in the BFA program for acting

[00:36:57] I got a musical theater kid who's honest way to an audition right now

[00:37:01] And I just brought my daughter back from another audition so you guys are a lot of work

[00:37:06] Yeah, hey, I went to St. Joe's in Philly

[00:37:09] I had an academic and a theater scholarship and it paid for college so

[00:37:15] No, they love it and they're and they're all in and it's you know, it's one of those things where I was like

[00:37:18] I hope someone draws but now it's actually

[00:37:21] You know beneficial to have all these

[00:37:23] Yeah, you know little mimes around the house. I mean, you never know where you'll end up. I'm a personal injury attorney now

[00:37:31] So you are using that's a direct path

[00:37:34] Yeah

[00:37:36] I got you guys have the best of the hosting statements

[00:37:38] I tried

[00:37:39] On closing skits

[00:37:42] Closing model logs. I do that's a lot. I do that's a lot

[00:37:47] Like I would like to explain how the acts fell on my

[00:37:51] client's hand in song

[00:37:56] Interpretive dance

[00:38:00] But I think that's a point yeah, that's a point

[00:38:03] I don't want to gloss over or go too quick on

[00:38:07] Because the importance of Marco being able to hit those emotional beats

[00:38:11] Let's me and Tim write the story we want to write

[00:38:14] Because that way we don't have to use exposition. We don't have to say I'm angry with you

[00:38:20] Or you know, you read a comic and the person

[00:38:24] Is describing what's supposed to be happening in the panel?

[00:38:27] I can't believe you would do this. I'm so mad at you

[00:38:29] You shouldn't have to write that if you're working with an artist who can convey those emotions

[00:38:35] And that's so very important that frees us up

[00:38:40] To tell the exact kind of story we want to want we want to write

[00:38:43] Not have to use heavy-handed dialogue to explain the emotion that's happening in that scene

[00:38:50] I would rather work with someone like Marco who can nail those emotional beats every single time

[00:38:56] Than someone who wants to do big explosions or hyper-detailed like figures or whatever. I don't care

[00:39:05] You need to I need to understand what that person's feeling

[00:39:08] I need I need to have a great storyteller a storyteller and

[00:39:14] And and and nail those things because then I can write exactly how I want to write

[00:39:19] And I don't have to put on some other garbage in there that I think you'll find

[00:39:24] And a lot of comic books. Yeah today

[00:39:27] Well, and there's there isn't a lot of exposition

[00:39:30] I mean it's all told through the dialogue and it's not even that dialogue heavy and just between the dialogue that is there

[00:39:37] And the acting in the panels like I you know more ready forming my thoughts in terms of

[00:39:44] Jolene's probably the older sister stubborn like her mother

[00:39:49] The her younger sister who is there trying to convince her

[00:39:52] Who's like mom's mouthpiece does whatever you know mom says she's maybe a little afraid of mom and like that's not

[00:40:01] It spelled out, but just between how they interact the body language and the dialogue that is there

[00:40:06] Yeah, that's like two pages

[00:40:09] The book and you got all that information right?

[00:40:11] Right. That's because Marco can do it for you

[00:40:15] And it's he's framing the shots

[00:40:17] He's wrecking the shots. He's getting the emotion on the characters

[00:40:21] and that like

[00:40:23] You get all that that's what a comic book is

[00:40:26] It's not a bunch of writing and then

[00:40:28] Pictures that are somewhat associated with the writing

[00:40:31] It's the story told through both mediums at the same time with

[00:40:35] With color and and art and lettering and the actual words that are there

[00:40:41] And it's just it's so nice to be able to do that with this team

[00:40:45] You know with Marco and Jason and Justin

[00:40:48] That we have such we could have such trust in them that they're gonna absolutely mail all their parts so we can make our parts

[00:40:56] You know

[00:40:57] Just you know the way we want them

[00:40:59] Yeah, I don't want to give away

[00:41:01] You know i'm trying to avoid spoilers really for even the cold open but but but the end

[00:41:06] But again just in the in the middle

[00:41:09] Speaking of the to turn to the dialogue

[00:41:11] There was a bit that I love and it's right after the scene I just talked about but

[00:41:16] When Mara Beth like

[00:41:18] Or a Jolene follows after Mara Beth her daughter and I went to it now, so I got it right

[00:41:23] Mara Beth says to her discussions work best when they don't involve

[00:41:27] Assumptions. I mean that line I thought was so good

[00:41:32] It was just such like a like a teenager type of thing to like oh

[00:41:37] You've said this to me before mom and I'm throwing it right back in your face

[00:41:41] And I just thought that was just

[00:41:43] I loved it. I read it that's I think the eighth time I read it

[00:41:49] Good job, Tim. I think Tim

[00:41:52] No memory of it

[00:41:55] I think that's been said to Tim

[00:42:02] The thing is with

[00:42:04] You know looking at what marco's achieved and and boy just wait

[00:42:09] Just wait there you know there are some scenes that we're gonna

[00:42:13] We will eventually get to see this family at a point where they do interact

[00:42:18] And I won't say when it is it could be the past it could be

[00:42:21] Right the president could be but we'll see this family interact

[00:42:26] And the only thing I bring that up is because marco has pages

[00:42:32] Where the dynamic between these

[00:42:35] Each of these family members and their various combinations is absolutely

[00:42:41] 100%

[00:42:43] Accurate and true and genuine and the most remarkable thing I think that

[00:42:50] A good comic will do and and this pertains to all art or entertainment

[00:42:55] Is that it gives every reader or viewer the opportunity to engage

[00:43:00] Because they get to supply that text too like Jimmy you you finding that

[00:43:06] Information there and the interaction between jolene and her sister

[00:43:10] Um, you know, I'm finding that all that information about how this family actually works

[00:43:15] Pressure that's been exerted over jolene and now with Nathan out of the picture

[00:43:19] That's really ratcheting up on her right and so she's not only grieving

[00:43:23] But now she's getting a chick kicked out of her by her own family

[00:43:26] To uproot these children and take them back east

[00:43:30] A good piece of work

[00:43:33] Entertainment will give us the opportunity to enter and engage ourselves and it makes it you can feel it

[00:43:40] And and that's I can I can buy comic books all day long

[00:43:43] And they are marvelous and they are beautiful

[00:43:46] And staggering

[00:43:47] But they might not form that combination

[00:43:50] Uh and allow me to do some work too as a reader and engage

[00:43:54] So I'm just I think marco has done a remarkable job here

[00:43:58] Yeah, I think everybody has yeah

[00:44:02] Sorry marco didn't mean to cut you off

[00:44:04] No, but I think I think that's the that's the faith that these guys have in their writings to be able to

[00:44:09] To go

[00:44:11] It's gonna it'll show up. I mean there's a lot of stuff in there that you know when I'm

[00:44:15] They run the risk of me misinterpreting stuff, but it's so

[00:44:21] It's so pinpoint accurate like you know the the attitude comes with the dialogue and it you know

[00:44:25] It's like I sat there and agonized and it said well is she irritated or she this or she that it just reads really well on the page

[00:44:32] And so the acting kind of just

[00:44:35] Helps it's you know it lends itself to the to the script

[00:44:38] But I think a lot of times

[00:44:40] People don't trust their writing enough

[00:44:43] To do that, you know what I mean? Where they're like well

[00:44:45] I know what I mean, but is

[00:44:48] Devegan and know what I mean is James and I know what I mean is marco

[00:44:52] I mean is the color is gonna you know the letter you don't talk enough about the lettering

[00:44:56] But even in terms of the lettering like how how many people have to understand that

[00:45:00] And I don't ever remember there being and it's not like you can't write a memo for each panel now in this panel

[00:45:05] She said and in this panel she's irritated

[00:45:07] You know and and that would actually

[00:45:10] Probably kill some of that energy if I'm

[00:45:13] Being dictated what I'm supposed to do so just like what Tim said like if you

[00:45:17] If you read a good play, you don't need to see it. It just enhances what happens when you see it

[00:45:22] And if you read a good book you don't need to see the movie

[00:45:26] But if the movie's done well it enhances what you've seen and I think that's how their scripts are their scripts are

[00:45:31] You know aren't enjoyable to read now you know luckily

[00:45:34] And got to read them a couple of times but they

[00:45:38] Just kind of it just kind of helps out you know like it's already there. It's fully formed so

[00:45:43] I don't know where I was going but I was complimenting them and I

[00:45:48] Hey, thanks. Hey, we'll take it. Yeah

[00:45:50] Um well, I look I I love the first issue

[00:45:53] I got to the end of it

[00:45:55] And I was thoroughly annoyed that I now have to wait for you to

[00:46:00] April or something

[00:46:02] But the first issues out uh listeners this is for you now March 27th

[00:46:07] 2024 this is man caves 10th anniversary year

[00:46:10] They've been put out if you listen to the podcast you know the stuff man caves been put now

[00:46:14] Because I've had quite a few folks on here talking about the books because

[00:46:17] I really like them

[00:46:19] And when you listen to this it's going to be before March 27th

[00:46:22] So uh still reach out to your shop tell him uh you want morning star

[00:46:27] Add it to your pull list. I think you can I think man cave a lot of the times

[00:46:31] You can also get the issues right from man caves website

[00:46:34] As well which is very helpful just in case you don't have a local

[00:46:37] You know you don't have a local comic book shop near you

[00:46:40] But it's always good if you can get it from your local shop go ahead and do that and uh and support them

[00:46:45] But March 27th this you want us out. Yeah, I'm I'm a fan

[00:46:49] I don't think it's right to say it but if you know it in terms of like Spielberg and Steven King

[00:46:54] I mean I grew up

[00:46:55] You know ET was on all the time absolutely loved it later on discovered

[00:47:01] Kings dark tower series and absolutely devoured it so

[00:47:05] I always have those two entertainment uh you know touchstones um

[00:47:11] And a plus there were a number of years when I first got a cell phone

[00:47:14] I think the then five notes from close encounters was my ringtone

[00:47:21] But yeah, I thoroughly enjoyed the issue

[00:47:25] I cannot wait to drape or to get my hands on on issue number two

[00:47:29] But it's on my pull list

[00:47:31] Add it to yours listeners and yeah

[00:47:32] I cannot that David thanks for coming back at Tim

[00:47:35] I've been a fan of yours for a number of years

[00:47:37] This has been amazing to get to talk to you and and Marco your work on this book is absolutely incredible

[00:47:42] So um thank you. I'm gonna go and buy a bunch of Marco Finnegan stuff as soon as we get off this

[00:47:50] Please do

[00:47:53] So thank you again for joining me and um I already shouted after my brother

[00:47:56] So I don't have to do that now uh but listeners you know if you like it the podcast rate and review us

[00:48:01] Do all those things they they tell you to do because it's it's nice to hear and you know

[00:48:05] Well if you like it and you're listening which Byron tells me you are we'll we'll keep doing it

[00:48:10] And so thanks for listening

[00:48:12] For comic book yet he's crypto creator corner Jimmy Gosparo, and I will uh see you next time good night

[00:48:18] This is Byron O'Neal one of your hosts of the crypto creator corner brought to you by comic book yet

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