Joe Caramagna Interview - Space Chasers

[00:00:00] Your ears do not deceive you. You've just entered the Cryptid Creator Corner brought to you by your friends at Comic Book Yeti. So without further ado, let's get on to the interview. Hey everyone, this is... Hi Byron. Who is this? I'm your fairy godmother. I have a fairy godmother? Of course you do. I'm 50 years old, why haven't you shown up before? I appear when I'm needed. And I didn't need you in all these years? Do you want my help or not? Um...

[00:00:30] Sure. Exactly. I was just about to pitch our Patreon. Why would I need help with that? Because you're an idiot sometimes. That's hurtful. What were you going to put on there? We do comic stuff? So something along those lines? And this is why I'm here. You do know what people put on Patreon most of the time, right? Honestly, no. People need something a little bit spicy to entice them to support you.

[00:00:59] Nobody wants to see me shirtless. I doubt that's true. You are in pretty good shape considering your age. Thank you. Let's see. A little spicy. I've been bugging Jimmy to figure out what he's going to do. I know lately he's been playing around with his **** all the time. He loves to take it out and show it off. There's even a specific TikTok channel now. How's that sound? Not a bad start. People like Jimmy. What else you got?

[00:01:24] I told a story recently about being in a strip club with some of the four horsemen when I was working for WCW back in the day. I picked up an infection on my- WOOOOO! From the experience? I hate strip clubs. Is that better? Getting there? But maybe spicy shouldn't include infections you get in strip clubs. That's not sexy. We'll workshop it. Like I need more meat. At least tell them where to find it while we figure this out. Mother goddess, help this poor man.

[00:01:53] You can find us on Patreon at Cryptid Creator Corner Pod. I'll put it in the show notes. Anything else you'd like to remind me that I'm bad at? How much time do you have? Why do you look like Rosario Dawson anyway? I appear the way you want me to look. Okay, that's disturbing. Wait, have you been showing up in my dreams? I'll never tell. And we're done here. Y'all, Jimmy the Chaos Goblin strikes again.

[00:02:20] I should have known better than to mention I was working on my DC Universe meets Ravenloft hybrid D&D campaign on social media. My bad. He goes and tags a bunch of comics creators we know, and now I have to get it in gear and whip this campaign into shape so we can start playing. Another friend chimes in, are you going to make maps? It's fair to say it's been a while since I put something together, so I guess? Question mark? It was then that I discovered Arkenforge.

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[00:03:14] Check them out at Arkenforge.com and use the discount code YETI5 to get $5 off. I'll drop a link in the show notes for you. And big thanks to Arkenforge for partnering with our show. I think I'm going to make Jimmy play a goblin warlock just to get even. Hello, and welcome to Comic Book Yeti's Cryptid Creator Corner. I am one of your hosts, Jimmy Gasparo, and I have a very special guest with me today. First time on the podcast.

[00:03:40] He's a writer and a letterer, and we got some fun comics that we're going to talk about. Please, welcome to the podcast, Joe Caramagna. Joe, how are you doing? Jimmy, this is a very long time in the making, my friend. Yeah, I feel like it is. I think I did a series where I interviewed letterers for Comic Book Yeti.

[00:04:03] And I feel like maybe you were just busy at the time because I'm sure that I would have reached out to you because you've lettered so many, I mean, amazing comics. You know, any fan of Marvel comics, I'm sure is familiar with your lettering work. Yeah, been around a while.

[00:04:26] I think I was in research for this, was reading, you know, another interview that you had done over the years. And I think one of the things that stood out to me was it back in, I don't know, 2010 or 2012 that you had lettered like 100 issues of, was it amazing? Spider-Man and, you know, like a whole run. Yeah, I did. At one point I did 100 consecutive issues. Yeah. Wow.

[00:04:55] I mean, I can't believe that 2012 or 2010, 2012, whenever it was, doesn't seem like that long ago, but you don't see too many of the same letterers, even, you know, for, you know, for big two publications, like sticking with a run like that. Well, you also don't see too many writers or an artist that get a chance on a run like that. Right. Well, see that the good thing about being a letterer on a series is that you don't really get blamed when sales start to go down. So they keep me around. Right.

[00:05:25] I'm like the cockroach, you know, like you can't get rid of me. I'm about to blow your mind because you said that you remember when I lettered 100 consecutive issues. I just recently, maybe a few weeks ago, lettered my 300th Amazing Spider-Man. Oh my gosh. So yeah, that shows you how long I've been doing this. Wow. Also how often we publish Amazing Spider-Man, right? Well, yeah. Yeah.

[00:05:50] I, I, I'm, I'm the, the, my first thought was like how many different creative teams though, like was through that run? Like you had to, other than maybe like the, the, the whoever's in charge of like the, the group, you know, like the group editor or the individual editor, you have to be like the one person like the, of the, with the most consistency on, on, you know, throughout that many.

[00:06:20] Yeah. Yeah. Right. I'm the last man standing. Oh yeah. Wow. I've seen everyone. I w I started when they were doing that, the rotating cast of, of writers after a brand new day. And, uh, yeah, so I started in Mark Wade was writing Amazing Spider-Man. That's when Dan Slott was starting. Um, who else was, was doing that? I'm drawing a blank now. Maybe Mark Guggenheim at the time. Okay. They just had like rotating writers and artists. Yeah.

[00:06:49] And I was lettering them all. And then, uh, it became Dan Slott full time for awhile. And, uh, he was on there for a very long time too. So yeah. Yeah. I'm, I'm still around still here. Well, congrats, Joe. That's remarkable. Um, thank you. I always say that, uh, no matter what else I'm doing in life, I'm still going to be lettering Amazing Spider-Man until either they fire me or I'm dead. So it's my favorite.

[00:07:18] It was my favorite series as a kid. It's like the series that made me want to work in comics. So it's like, that's the one thing like I want to still be doing. Like they can take other stuff away from you and move me around. It doesn't matter. You know, but amazing Spider-Man, I always want to do. It's like my book. So I enjoy reading it for free. Yeah, I bet. I mean, that's incredible.

[00:07:41] Um, as, as a writer yourself, um, it, do you get into like, you know, different modes? Like when, when you're lettering a comic and having worked with so many different creative teams, like if you hadn't been a writer before, it almost seems a bit, if you're able to, you I guess, pay attention enough, like a little bit of like a master class in comic scripting

[00:08:08] to go through that many, like different creative teams on, on a book like that. Like, do you, do you think like, well, I'm, I'm a writer. I know how to write. I do these things. Or do you ever, when they put somebody on a book, you're like, oh man, I'm really going to get to check out this script. Does that cross your, like your mind at all? Do you take time to do that? Are you solely focused on, you know, just lettering? No, like I, I definitely pay attention to that.

[00:08:36] I always say that, uh, I probably wouldn't be a working writer had I not lettered so many, like Ed Brubaker comics and Mark Wade comics. Um, I'd learned so much from lettering their scripts and they're also, they just happen to be very generous with their time and entertaining, you know, whatever questions I have or, you know, comments. And, um, they always were willing to offer advice. So, um, lettering those books is extremely valuable.

[00:09:06] It was very valuable to what I do now for sure. Yeah. And I worked with a lot of great writers. Like I even worked with Stan Lee at one point. I lettered a Stan Lee comic way back in the day. Did you really? Oh yeah. I were, it was a special, uh, I forget which issue it was, but it was like a one shot. Okay. Um, and so I've worked with everybody and wow, it's, it's so great to be able to compare them and to see their different approaches.

[00:09:35] Um, it's definitely like, uh, I'm surprised there aren't more letters who are writers just for that reason, just because you, you get to learn so much and you see it in the, in the whole process along the chain. You don't just see the final product. You see how it's actually made. You see the notes from editorial. Um, you know, going back and forth with the writers about what they should change and why. So you really, I don't know how you can't learn from that experience.

[00:10:05] It's amazing. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. Um, but that, that is incredible. Three, 300 issues too. Wow. Yeah. It's exhausting, but it's good. It's good. I love it. Like I seriously, I wouldn't want to do anything else. Like I just love working on amazing Spider-Man. So no matter what else I'm doing, no matter how many books I'm writing, like that's, that would be the last thing I would ever give up. If I had to give up to make room in my schedule, that would be the very last thing.

[00:10:35] Okay. Well, I mean, make, makes a lot of sense. That would, that would be the last thing on the list you'd want to give up. Uh, and well, I want to switch. I want to get, I want to go eventually make our way back to talking about lettering and how you got into it. Um, but I know that you have a book coming out, uh, space chasers, which is going to be out February 4th. So I think we're recording this episode. Actually, this is my first episode that we're recording in 2025.

[00:11:05] Uh, as, as we record this on, uh, on in, in early January. But, um, when this episode drops, uh, folks will be able to get ready for the, it'll be right before February 4th and space chasers is out. And, um, yeah, you, you sent me over. Oh yeah, you have it. I have an advanced copy right here. Yeah. Fantastic. Um, yeah.

[00:11:29] So you had mentioned this when we, you know, we scheduled the podcast that, um, this is something that you were working on and, uh, I was delighted because to see that it was written along with Leland Melvin, who I instantly recognized as the astronaut who in his official NASA photo has his two dogs in it. Like just new run. As soon as I saw Leland Melvin, I was like, Oh wow.

[00:11:57] Um, so it's, uh, and I think Leland Melvin is also a character in space chasers. In the book. Yeah. Which is a lot of fun. You and Leland Melvin are writing it. It's illustrated by Alison Acton. Um, and yeah, I mean, this sounds great. Middle school book. Uh, your, your main character I think is, is Tia who applies like a, for a test to be part

[00:12:25] of some NASA program to develop like a, I guess the next generation of space station. Um, I mean, and then of course I'm sure something goes wrong and the kids all have to get together to figure it out. It's just sounds like the, like, I mean, when I was a kid, I'm 45 now, but man, space and anything about space, like the movie space camp, like there were so many things geared, you know, towards space and space exploration.

[00:12:54] And I was like a fan of all of them, whether it was the more realistic or like Star Trek, the next generation, which hit at the same time. Yeah. I was always kind of fascinated by it. Um, so I'm kind of curious in terms of like how this like came about, how you ended up getting involved in the writing of space chasers. And then, you know, did you have that early fascination with space exploration? Like I think, uh, you know, like, like I did, or, um, was, was, was this kind of new to

[00:13:24] you learning anything about space in order to write with, uh, Leland Melvin? Well, I mean, like you, I'm a somewhat of a child of the eighties, right? So, um, I have very vivid memory of, uh, the Challenger explosion. Oh, so yeah. Oh, geez. That is something that kind of made me, um, a little fascinated with space because I, that

[00:13:50] seems like the moment in time where I realized how dangerous it is, you know, space travel, because I wasn't born for, you know, the Apollo missions in Apollo one that blew up and Apollo 13, where, you know, they, they nearly had a disaster in space. Right. Um, so for me, the Challenger explosion was like, like, whoa, like this is like dangerous stuff. Like it's not like Star Trek, you know, it's not like Star Wars. Like this is really a, not that there's no danger in there.

[00:14:19] I mean, come on, they're dealing with like lightsabers and stuff, but like, you realize that it's not just as routine as it became in our lives. It's not routine. Like Leland tells me all the time when we're working together, we're working out plots. And, uh, I always ask him like, well, what if this happens? He goes, well, we all die. Like, well, okay. But then what if, what if this happens? Then we all die. It's like, so like, there's like a 90% chance that everybody dies. How does anyone make it safely to space and back?

[00:14:49] Like, it's amazing. It's really incredible. And, uh, the way that Leland and I got, got together is that I had been writing for a publisher and, uh, he came to me and said that Leland Melvin was pitching him ideas for a graphic novel. And like, he'd never written graphic novels. Um, so he said, well, maybe if I put you guys together and maybe you can help each other. So I said, you know, who's, who's Leland Melvin? Like the name sounds familiar. I'm not sure. And he goes, oh, it's the astronaut with the dogs.

[00:15:19] I'm like, oh yeah. Yeah. Now I know exactly who it is. That's how I know his name. He's the astronaut with the dogs. Absolutely. And, uh, you know, we, we connected and we had a series of phone calls and Leland is an amazing guy. Um, just has a great story. Great history knows everything, uh, that there is about space.

[00:15:45] And most importantly, he knows how to explain everything to a dummy like me, who isn't very like science oriented, you know, like I was always more concerned with like the human condition and human emotions. And that's like the perspective that I write from. I'm not really like a science geek or anything like that. I had an interest, but I was never like, you know, like intensely like focused on, I never wanted to be an astronaut or anything like that. So I was never like into astronomy or anything like that.

[00:16:15] I just like, you know, the drama of it all. So it's really great to be able to work with somebody who just knows so much and can explain it to me in a way that makes me understand it. Um, so it's, it's no like surprise that he worked in like the education division of NASA, uh, after his, uh, you know, space missions were over because, uh, he's such a great communicator and very artistic, very artsy.

[00:16:42] Um, which I have come to learn is a common trait among astronauts actually. Uh, yeah. I mean, for any listeners who, you know, aren't familiar with who we're talking about or might just, you know, know Leland Melvin's name from the, the, you know, the NASA photo with the, the two dogs in it. I mean, I, his career, he worked for NASA for a number of years, uh, space shuttle Atlantis. He also played in the NFL.

[00:17:09] He helped develop, I think the white house or the department of education's like STEM program in terms of what they wanted kids to learn to develop them education. Um, he's also a photographer and a musician. I mean, like, it's incredible. He's an amazing guy. He's an incredible guy and very nice, like extremely nice, very thoughtful, nice guy that we get along very well.

[00:17:36] And it's so cool that, um, you know, I could be like just driving in the car and all of a sudden you see the, the picture of the two dogs come up on the screen. Cause he's calling me. I'm like, this is the coolest thing ever. And I've known him now for maybe six years, maybe five, at least five years. Um, this project has been in development since before COVID we, um, we sold the book in 2019 actually. Oh wow. That's a, yeah, that's a long time develop. Yeah.

[00:18:05] It's a long time, but the reason is because, um, when we sold the book, they said, well, we don't want to buy the book. We want to buy a series. So this is actually the first book in a series of space chasers. Um, and they're actually all written and, uh, Allison actually completed, uh, the art for the second book and she started on the third one now.

[00:18:30] So, um, we're, we're moving and shaking on this thing, but it's been a long time in the making. Very long time. Yeah. I mean that, that must, uh, you know, to be right as we record, like, like a month away, like on the cusp of it, something that you've been working for for so long. Um, but that must have be a nice feeling to know that it's, it's right there. Right. Oh man. When I got the advanced copies, I was like a child.

[00:19:00] I was like running around my house holding the book. I'm like, it's real. I can't believe that it's real. It's been so long. We've been talking about it for so long and working on it for so many years now. Um, it, it's just so cool to see it, that it's a real thing and you know, I can hold it and flip through it. Like it's amazing. Like that feeling. And I've been making comics now for 19 years.

[00:19:24] Um, since I started, uh, freelancing and it just never gets old to see that it becomes a real thing. Um, cause when you're involved in the making of something from, especially when it's as a writer, you start with just like a one sentence idea. And then to actually come out with a printed book that you can go in a store and see, it's like magic. It's, it's the coolest. It's really the coolest thing ever.

[00:19:53] So, and it never gets old. Like you, that feeling is always there. Like you're like, I can't even believe that this, like, how did we pull this off? It's incredible. It, I mean, I did a little bit in terms of just for my understanding about, um, you know, what space chasers was about, but, um, I mean, is there anything in terms of like the, the, like the overall series?

[00:20:17] Is it, is it really about the, I mean, the, the, the kids not only learning about space, but learning to, you know, work together and the problems they encounter in space. I mean, is that idea, and I'm sure it's handled in a, you know, a middle school appropriate way that I think, what does Matt Damon say in the Martian? Like space wants to kill you. Like, uh, is that, is that concept like kind of brought to the fore a little bit as to the danger of it? Yeah, definitely.

[00:20:46] Uh, I describe it as, uh, it's sort of like Willy Wonka meets space camp. Um, but what I like that. Yeah. And, uh, what it's really about though, is how space is for everybody and the future is for everybody. Um, no matter who you are or where you're from or how you were born, like everybody has the right stuff. Like everybody's good at something that is useful. You know, everybody has value.

[00:21:13] And actually the main character Tia, her last name is Valor, V-A-L-O-R, which, you know, in, in English it spells valor, which is like courage under fire. Right. In Portuguese, Valor means to have value, to have worth. And Tia doesn't believe that she has anything to offer.

[00:21:34] And, uh, she quickly learns that when, you know, she's, when she's in the soup and things are going down and things get serious that, you know, that's where you find out that, you know, that's where you test your metal. And, uh, that's really what the series is about. It's how everybody has something to offer. Everybody has some worth and we need to have like a diversity of thought to solve the major problems that we have in the world.

[00:22:01] And not just things like deforestation or like freshwater depletion or climate change and things like that, but even societal problems. Like to really understand things, you need a variety of just different perspectives to learn how to really solve a problem that works for everybody.

[00:22:21] And if you have just the same type of people working on a solution, people who are educated similarly from maybe the same place, um, you're, they're all going to kind of reach the same conclusion. Like we really need to figure out solutions that work for everybody to move forward. And that's where everyone has value. Everyone has a point of view. Everyone has perspective. Everyone has something that they're good at.

[00:22:46] Like Leland and I say, you know, if you're really good at video games, you're probably going to be really good on a flight simulator too. So yeah, we're hoping that we can inspire kids to pursue careers in steam, not just STEM. Leland always corrects me. Oh, but steam because art is a big part of it. You're right. Um, that's where the creativity comes in. So, you know, we're hoping that we can inspire kids to maybe, you know, not sell them.

[00:23:16] Sell themselves short and believe that they can apply that the skills that they're good at. And, you know, literally reach for the stars because we need everyone to move into the future. Wow. That, that is awesome. I, I, Joe, I love that. I mean, that's just fantastic. And to think it's a going to be a series of books. And this is just the, the first in that series. I mean, I, I just, I love that idea.

[00:23:42] You know, I'm a dad, I'm a parent myself, um, have two kids that are 12 and seven. Um, I think this is probably right in the, right in that zone where both of, uh, both of them would, would really like it. Uh, you know, would kind of get into it and want to check out these characters and, and know, know more about face. My youngest, my seven year old right now, she's, she likes to, you know, she has like a, there's an app on my phone that tells you what the constellations are.

[00:24:11] And she's always, she always wants to know like, what is that? Is that a planet? Which one is that? My daughter too. She has a similar, probably the same app. Um, but she's actually, she's a senior in high school now and she's looking at colleges and she does want to be an astronaut. So she absolutely is blown away that I know Leland Melvin. She, she didn't need to be told that it's the astronaut with the dog. She knew who he was. Right.

[00:24:40] And, uh, so she's fascinated by all this stuff. So that really, it wasn't really, um, you know, my interest in space as a kid that really made me excited about this is my daughter's interest. She's all into astronomy. Um, and, uh, she wants to study astrophysics in college. So, um, you know, it's, it's getting serious. It's getting there. Yeah. She was definitely an inspiration. And as a matter of fact, I dedicated the book to her. Oh, that's awesome. Awesome. Well, good luck.

[00:25:09] My other two kids aren't too happy about that, but yeah, well, I mean, you'll dedicate something else to them. It's a series. I told them they get one inch. Yeah. I, I, I, I've only ever met one. I met one ass, you know, an astronaut once before that was the, um, I think my wife worked at a, at a, uh, a school in Delaware County in PA.

[00:25:35] And at one point in time, the, uh, the president of the school for like a year or two while she worked there was a former astronaut. Oddly enough named Guy Gardner. Oh, okay. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Um, but, uh, I, I, and, um, I remember before we were going to her work holiday party, she's like, oh, and you're going to get to meet the president of Williamson was the name of the school. And I'm like, oh, who's that?

[00:26:04] And she's like, Guy Gardner. And I'm like the green lantern. And she's like, no, but he was a former astronaut. And I'm like, he was an astronaut. That's amazing. Uh, but yeah, very, very exciting stuff and exciting that you're, you're, you know, most times whenever somebody is on here, who's a parent, it's like their kids do not, are not impressed by, by anything.

[00:26:29] It is really nice to hear that your daughter is, you know, impressed that, uh, you're involved in these books, Joe. That's, that gives hope to all parents out there. Well, I finally did something to impress my kids. Yeah. They don't care about, you know, I've worked on so many Marvel comics. They're like, yeah, cause it's, that's what I've been doing all their lives. You know, like I said, I've been doing this for 19 years. I started my Marvel internship 25 years ago. Right. Yeah.

[00:26:58] They don't care about Spider-Man. They don't, they don't care about DuckTales. No, not at all. They, you know what they like when, um, I got them into like free screenings of the Marvel movies. That's, that's when they're impressed. Like I bring them to the Marvel screenings and, uh, they save their little tickets and take pictures outside. Yeah. That's the one thing that impressed them. Like the, the MCU and now, uh, knowing an astronaut. Yeah. Yeah. And now this, well, that's great.

[00:27:28] Space Chasers, February 4th. It's volume one. That's right. Um, yeah. And I think I, it's like 240 pages. It is. Yeah. So that's a, that is sizable. That is fantastic. Um, that's what happens when they say just make it as many pages as you like. Yeah. Like a whole, okay.

[00:27:49] Well, in working on it at all, you said, I mean, you know, you said you weren't, um, really interested in the science of it, but that Leland was able to explain a lot of things, but did working on it at all? Or maybe that, you know, working on space chasers combined with your daughter's interest.

[00:28:06] Did it, did it give you like any curiosity about some of those things? Like, you know, uh, to, to want to go into space to think like, Oh, if there was ever a chance, like if there was a, if I had an opportunity, like if there, if there was commercial space flights and it was affordable. Uh, would it, you ever consider doing it or.

[00:28:28] I would never want to go to space unless it were like a baby Kal-El situation and the planet was blowing up and I had to, that would be, that'd be the only way I can't see myself ever going to space. It, it frightens me, especially when Leland is telling me like, Oh, if this happens, everyone dies. I mean, I don't, I don't even go on roller coasters. So, hey. That was Penny. Just popped up.

[00:28:56] Hi, Penny. Yeah. Joe says, hi. Hi. Hi. That's my seven year old. That's Penny. Oh, nice. I miss those days. See, my youngest is turning 17 next month. So, okay. Yeah. It's terrible. I'm sorry. I have a little ways to go, but no, you, you were saying you don't even like roller coasters.

[00:29:17] Yeah. I don't even like roller coasters, so I can't see myself going to space and it scares my wife to death that our daughter wants to be an astronaut. But I mean, I think that's cool. I, I mean, as afraid as I would be like, it's, it's like air travel, you know, like people are afraid to fly in planes, but you see, it's so incredibly safe.

[00:29:37] I mean, especially compared to driving a car, like they really, um, they really got it down. I mean, uh, you know, all the, the Boeing controversies notwithstanding, but you know, it is very safe. So you see, like there's, we're sending astronauts to the ISS like over and over again.

[00:29:57] And you never really hear about, you know, I know there's a couple of astronauts that are kind of somewhat stranded there now, but you know, they're safe, you know, their lives are in danger. So aren't in danger. So, um, yeah, it, it really is safe. It's just, uh, They just have a bit of an extended stay on the, uh, on the space station. Yeah. But everything is so super safe now that it's, it's incredible considering how many things can go wrong. Like you said, Matt Damon says like space is trying to kill you.

[00:30:24] And it's true. We're not supposed to be up there, you know? And it's, it's amazing how safe it is. Can all things considered. Yeah. Well, that's, I was just curious. Cause I would think like, you know, I've, I was so enamored with it as a kid and I would just be like, I was, I always think like, yeah, I, I, you know, if there was a way that it was affordable, I think I'd do it. Um, although who was it? There was a celebrity that went into space recently. Was it William Shatner? William Shatner went up. Yeah.

[00:30:53] But what he wrote about afterwards was some of the most deeply terrifying, like existential crises. I think I've ever like read just how, you know, it wasn't, I guess it wasn't what he thought, you know? I think he had wrote, I, I, I can probably put a link to the show notes if I can find it, but he, it just seemed like it made him feel very like small and alone.

[00:31:15] Um, right. There is, I think there's a word for it. There's a, there's, um, like a name for it when you're up in space and you look down on the earth for the first time and the feeling you have for it. I wish Leland were here to explain this. Um, but it is like a, it's a, it's a phenomenon. It's like, um, how, you know, you have a, like this, this deep feeling that you're like, wow.

[00:31:40] It's like, I can't believe how obviously it looks different from up there, but, um, and we, we touch on this in the book. Like when you're up there, you don't see borders. You don't see anything. You don't see any differences. You just see like one big planet.

[00:31:56] And when you're on the space station, you see it, you see every part of it, every 90 minutes that you're going around. So it's, uh, this incredible feeling. I wish I remembered like what they call it. Um, I'm going to have to, I'm gonna have to find out from Leland, but yeah, it does, it does do something to you. It really does do something to you. So I remember reading that was Shatner wrote, but I don't remember what he said.

[00:32:22] Yeah. I, I, if I find it, I'll put it in the show notes for, for, uh, for listeners so they can, they can, they can, uh, uh, read about Shatner's trip to space. But, um, yeah, I, I think, I just remember him saying something like it, it, it made him sad or filmed, filled, filled him with sadness. But, um, yeah.

[00:32:45] Yeah. I mean, I can imagine never having been up to space, obviously, but I can imagine how it makes you feel so small and insignificant in a way, you know, like we worry about things that really most things that we worry about or we get upset about that. And that bother us really don't mean anything, um, in the grand scheme of things when you realize how large everything is.

[00:33:11] And we're just like a little speck on a, on a small little thing that's flying through space. I mean, it's, it's pretty incredible to think about.

[00:33:20] Yeah. And when you're dealing with your day to day issues or problems or, uh, you know, anxieties, whatever, you know, whatever it is that is, is occupying your time. And then, you know, it's hard for us to wrap our heads around or like, I won't, I won't speak for every human. It's hard for me to wrap my head around like exactly how like big.

[00:33:43] Yeah. Yeah. Universe is. And I think even getting a glimpse of that from the other side from space, you know, would, would be terrifying, uh, you know, a little bit. I would, um, but that's why when I, when I was reading about space chasers, like the group of kids that are there, um, seems like a very diverse group, but also, um, the idea of the, that, you know, uh, team building.

[00:34:13] Or working together, I think is the, the only way, um, you know, you would, you would have to get through space travel. Uh, I mean, I, I, I don't think that could ever be a space travel could ever be like accomplished, accomplished as like a solo endeavor. Right. Oh yeah, for sure. And just like I said, uh, these books kind of taught me a lot about space and human space flight. Um, these characters also taught me a lot because I'm writing about, you know, it's an ensemble cast.

[00:34:43] I mean, we focused on the first book, mostly on Tia, but it's an ensemble cast and they're all different and they have all different backgrounds and just trying to see the world through their eyes. Um, you know, you, you really do learn a lot. Like we have a character named Steven who has cerebral palsy and he uses a wheelchair.

[00:35:02] And I suddenly found myself like noticing all the wheelchair ramps, you know, on the street and lack of wheelchair ramps is really what, like, I guess it's not strange to notice a wheelchair ramp, but then I started noticing where there weren't, you know, because I had like sort of lived the experience through his eyes.

[00:35:25] Yeah. And so it's not just that learning about space, it's just learning about people. You know, when you have, um, all these different types of people that you can see, you know, you look at things through their lens. It's pretty incredible. It's like probably my favorite thing about writing is just learning about humans and why we do things and how we do things. It's pretty awesome. Uh, and like, you know, working, since I worked on these books, going back a little bit, what we were talking about,

[00:35:55] you know, thinking about, um, you know, thinking about, you know, the planet and how huge everything is. I noticed that like, I, I started just looking up in the sky, like just stopping like, like once a day, I just stop and I just like look up and like, I know there, there's science behind it, but it still feels like it's a miracle, you know, that, that we're here, that we're alive and how everything works and everything has to go right.

[00:36:25] For us to be alive here on this planet, you know? Oh yeah. So there's other planets where the conditions don't support life and it's just incredible. Like I, it gave me such a deep appreciation for just everything that we have.

[00:36:40] And it totally changed my perspective, just learning about space. So I hope that other people get that same feeling. Like when they get inspired, hopefully by reading these books and they want to learn more about space and, and you know, the planet, our own planet, that they get a similar feeling.

[00:36:58] That's awesome. Oh, I can't wait to read it. Um, and, uh, a shout out to my brother, Bobby, who is a cryptid creator corners. Number one, most dedicated fan. Bobby listens to all my, my episodes. And, um, he goes to Baltimore comic-con with me every year. Listeners of the podcast know. Cause I talk about Bobby. Like I shout up, I shout him out every episode, but, um, hopefully Bobby's going to want to copy as well. I don't, hopefully he won't mind me saying this, but Bobby has four kids and, um, he has a daughter and he has three.

[00:37:27] Uh, identical, uh, identical triplet son. Wow. Yeah. And, uh, Cooper, uh, one of the sons has a cerebral palsy and, um, it, it, it, it's, you know, when, when you have somebody like Cooper in the family and Cooper's awesome, um, you, you know, you see, and I, I, I, not all the time firsthand. It's, you know, it's my nephew, but with Bobby and his wife, like, and the other kids, like you, you see every time,

[00:37:57] they have to do something like what, you know, that entails. Um, and, uh, no, I think it's, you know, Bobby, Bobby loves that. You don't see much somebody in a, especially in a comic and other things you do, but someone with cerebral palsy. And, um, you know, something like that is, uh, I think a great addition. Like, I can't, I can't wait, wait to, uh, read about Steven and, and, uh,

[00:38:24] get Bobby a copy of the book so he can read it to Cooper. That's awesome. Awesome. Yeah. I can't wait to hear what he thinks of it. Uh, well, I will, uh, I'll let you know. Um, but Joe, I wanted to kind of circle back a little bit if we could, in terms of like your career and first getting into writing and lettering. I know that you went to the, I think the Cooper school early on. And is that what led to your Marvel internship?

[00:38:50] Yeah, actually it, it directly led to my Marvel internship. I never actually applied to be a Marvel intern. Marvel came to the Qbert school, uh, to look for interns for, they were doing an in-house lettering department. Um, I guess they, they want to have some of the lettering done there on site. Okay. Um, but they needed letterers. So they came to the Qbert school looking for interns that they could then train and hopefully they would end up working in house in the lettering department.

[00:39:19] So my lettering instructor at the time, because when you go to the Qbert school, as a lot of my fellow QBs and former QBs know, um, they insist that you learn everything about making comics. So you have to learn your lettering. You have to learn inking. You learn everything like soup to nuts, everything. So it doesn't matter if you want to be a penciler, you're going to learn how to letter too. You're going to learn everything. So, um, my instructor at the time was high Eisman, who's a, uh, old school cartoonist.

[00:39:49] He, um, what did he work on? Uh, Popeye for many years. Um, Dondi, if you're familiar. Um, no, I don't know that one. Oh, you gotta look it up. Is that a strip or like a cereal? Yeah, it's a strip. Yeah. Okay. Um, so he was my lettering instructor and he actually recommended me and a couple of others to Marvel and we went to go interview and I don't know. Wow. They, they chose me for some reason.

[00:40:13] And, um, you know, that, that really, uh, led me down a path because I don't know what I would have done otherwise, because I went to the QBs school to become a penciler. And I learned real quick that that wasn't in the cards for me because, you know, it's one thing to be, uh, most artistic in your high school yearbook. But then when you walk into a school that's filled with people who are most artistic in their high school yearbook, it's pretty intimidating.

[00:40:39] And some of the most talented people, even today that I ever met, um, were in my class and went to the school. So, uh, yeah, I, I, I knew that I had to lean into other things. So I took every class seriously and I tried really hard in lettering and I guess high, uh, noticed that. And he recommended me and somehow I managed to manage to fool them. They hired me.

[00:41:03] Well, I mean, it's, I, I think if it, if it was, if you did fool them, if it was a trick, it was one of the best ones ever pulled because you would, you'd have to think if that you weren't any good at it, you wouldn't have been doing it as long as you have been. Uh, I think even more than being good at it is trying really hard to be good at it. Um, that cause I don't, I don't even know if I'm good at it, but I, I am always trying to be better.

[00:41:31] So I guess that's a quality that works for you. If anyone's listening for any advice, that's mine. Always try to get better. So had you, um, had you wanted to write or thought about writing before you started lettering or was it like the Hubert school? I want to be a penciler. Now I'm lettering. And then later the writing came or did you always have some desire to write?

[00:41:59] You know, I always say that I wanted to write because I wanted to draw and I needed stories to draw. Um, but I'm not sure that's true. I think even younger than that, I was like, um, I, I probably have so many novels that I started and just abandoned, you know?

[00:42:18] So I was always into writing and I remember even in fifth grade, um, I used to write this serial of stories that were just like one page, like the old loose leaf line college ruled paper. I would just make each episode. I'll call them just one sheet and I would write it out by hand. And I always, um, left it on my teacher's desk, hoping for like some kind of feedback, you know, like, let me know, like, let me know how this is.

[00:42:48] And, you know, Ms. Barron, I remember her fifth grade teacher and she did. She always said, Hey, I liked that story. That was, that was a good one. That was great. So, uh, I, even before I wanted to be a comic book penciler, I was into writing stories. Um, so when I got to the Hubert school and I realized that being a penciler probably wasn't in the cards for me, I leaned into everything and we had to take a writing class too at the time.

[00:43:15] So, um, I started not just concentrating on my writing class, but writing my own assignments and taking that very seriously because we have to like Joe, Joe Hubert would tell us like, okay, um, draw a three page chase scene. And I would actually sit down and write the script for it. I wouldn't just like thumbnail out like a chase scene, like, you know, cars or horses, whatever.

[00:43:43] Yeah. I actually like wrote the script and had a printed copy of the script on my desk and worked from that. So, um, as soon as I had the opportunity to write a story, um, you know, I, I jumped at it. So, you know, for Marvel. So, cause I'd been working toward, I, I wanted to do anything.

[00:44:06] So, I just constantly practiced everything hoping that my lettering, uh, internship and later my lettering freelancing would lead to something. And, you know, thankfully it did. Wow. And so I think your, what was your, the first thing you ever wrote for Marvel? Was it like a, like a Fantastic Four? Yep. Yeah. It was the Marvel Adventures Fantastic Four.

[00:44:28] Wow. So, um, as you went through writing for Marvel and, and lettering, um, how did then something like, you know, you start working with, uh, like on DuckTales? Oh boy. Oh, that was many years later.

[00:44:47] Oh yeah. I mean, I know it was, but I mean, I just, you know, kind of curious as to how then like that stuff comes about just from you getting to know people in the, the industry. I mean, is that something working on a property like that? Um, I think it was what with ID. IDW. Yeah. The time. Yeah. Is that something that like you have to pitch them or they approach you like, Oh, Hey Joe, we hear you like, you know, we, we like this of yours.

[00:45:16] And we're doing DuckTales. Well, uh, we'd probably have to work a little bit backwards to figure out how that all came about because as you know, Disney bought Marvel at some point. Right. And, uh, some people who worked for Marvel then moved over and started working for Disney.

[00:45:36] And I didn't just write like Marvel adventures, fantastic four. And then, you know, somehow, you know, get a job later years later, I was writing all this stuff that most people probably never even saw. Like a lot of custom comics, um, you know, backup stories and a lot of the all ages books, things like that. So I was working on a lot of all ages stuff. I don't know if you know, but I, I wrote the Taco Bell Captain America comic.

[00:46:02] Thank you. That they, they, um, that they gave out with Taco Bell. Yeah. Taco Bell kids meals. Yeah. Uh, so I, I wrote a lot of stuff. I know it now. Yeah. I, I wrote a lot of stuff that a lot of people, a lot of comic fans weren't aware of. I'm very familiar with your all ages. You know, Marvel stuff. Um, uh, probably because like trying to get my kids into, uh, comics and superhero comics.

[00:46:30] We, you know, I, I latched onto any of those all ages ones that I could find and they were fantastic. Oh yeah. And I wrote a ton of those things. And like I said, people, uh, who worked at Marvel then were working at Disney and you know, they, they knew me from writing all ages stuff.

[00:46:50] So I started writing some short stories for Disney, Disney comics. Um, I was working on Zootopia. Um, you know, a whole bunch of things that, um, a lot of them never even saw print in the United States. Actually a lot of stuff. Um, Oh really? Like just, it was marketed for, you know, like, well, Disney just Europe or somewhere else. Yeah, exactly. Right. Okay. And, uh, some things just go straight to Disney magazine.

[00:47:18] Like it's not stuff that comic book fans would, would find in the shop on a Wednesday, you know, a lot of Disney stuff that ended up elsewhere in other parts of, of publishing. Um, so I was working on, I ended up working actually on comics that were tied into some Mickey mouse video game that I don't think ever came out.

[00:47:41] So they canceled the project and because they canceled that project, they said, well, Hey, we're, um, working on a three Caballeros, uh, animated series and we want to do tie in comics. So do you want to do that instead of the Mickey mouse? I love the three Caballeros. Me too. And I'm like, you know what? I would love to do that. Yes. So I started working on that. And before I even had the chance to even write one script, they said, Oh, you know what? We're canceling that project.

[00:48:09] Um, would you mind writing duck tales? And I was like, what? Really? Well, that's like the best thing you've said so far. Like I loved the Mickey mouse game and I loved, you know, three Caballeros, but yes, I would love to write duck tales. Are you kidding me? Yeah. So that's how it came about. Like I was working on other things that was, that were getting canceled and duck tales didn't. And it turned out to be, uh, you know, fairly popular.

[00:48:36] Oh yeah. I mean, they're for listeners, for any listeners who haven't like read them or think that, Oh, they're more geared towards kids. Like, yeah, I read them to my kids. Um, yeah, Charlotte's 12 now. And I think a lot of them were, you know, when they were, they were coming out.

[00:48:53] I know I saw you, Joe, your name on quite a few of them that we bought at the comic book shop. They they're, they're delightful. They're just, they're so good. Um, the art is phenomenal. The stories are a lot of fun. The only downside is I, when I read would read to my kids before they learned how to read, I like to do voices and I can do an okay Scrooge, but I suck at Donald.

[00:49:17] Donald. Yeah. You can't, I can't, no one, you can't do Donald's voice. And what's funny is you're, you're trying to write Donald duck dialogue, but none of it reads right because you can't say it like in the Donald duck voice, you know, like sometimes I, I read the lines out loud to see if they make sense. Oh, sure. It sounds so sophisticated. That doesn't sound like Donald duck because you're not doing the, the, the voice.

[00:49:42] Yeah. So Donald was such a difficult character to write for that reason. Like you have to almost try to listen in your head of what it would sound like because he certainly can't do it. Right. Yeah. No, that's, I, that makes sense. Yeah. I'm someone, when I write, I say that I say the dialogue out loud too. Like my, my wife will, if I write downstairs and my wife walks by, she's like, did you say something? And I'm like, I'm just trying to write. She goes, why are you talking out loud? I'm like, I need to hear it. That's the writer's life. Yeah. I never thought about that.

[00:50:12] Talking to yourself. Yeah. A character who has a difficult voice trying to get the dialogue right. Yeah. That must be a challenge with Donald.

[00:50:21] For sure. For some reason also on, on frozen, like it was such a struggle for me to write Olaf's dialogue because I couldn't do the voice. Like I could hear what it sounds like. Like I know how Josh Gad says it. And when I hear it, I'm like, oh yeah, duh. But then when I'm just sitting at my computer trying to read back like Olaf dialogue, I can't do the voice. And it's like, like, ah, it doesn't sound right. I don't know. But the dialogue was fine. It was just my voice didn't sound right.

[00:50:48] So in my head, I'm like, oh, this dialogue doesn't seem like it's in Olaf's voice. Were there any, just because I'm like fascinated with the, you know, the DuckTales universe in the new series that was out and also the comics, were there any side characters that you really love when they, you know, being able to use in a story that you're like, oh, this is great.

[00:51:13] Oh my gosh. Um, there were a lot of characters that I wanted to write and they, they wouldn't let me for one reason or another. Kind of think if there's any, you know, um, I don't know. I, I loved Louie so much that I didn't really focus too much on the side, the side characters or like the background characters.

[00:51:35] Uh, I would, uh, I, I pitched so many Louie stories that at one point they're like, Joe, you gotta, you gotta stop. We, we have, we can't just make this a Louie series. You have to spread it around and, and pitch us some other characters as the, the focus of the story. But I just love that character so much. It was great. Like if you remember the show, he was like a schemer, you know, like a, like a con man always like with his get rich quick schemes. It was a lot of fun.

[00:52:02] So, yeah. Oh, that's phenomenal. Um, uh, so, uh, is there anything else? I mean, not that writing, um, you know, uh, more than one volume of space chasers and, and the lettering work that you do. Is there anything else you had, you know, coming out that, um, listeners should be on the lookout for?

[00:52:23] Yeah, I do. Uh, exactly one month after the first space chasers book, I have a middle grade novel coming out that I wrote with, uh, YouTubers that maybe your kids might be familiar with the FGTV, uh, family, the funnel vision. Uh, they have a whole bunch of channels. Um, I wrote, I co-wrote with them, uh, a middle grade novel called FGTV presents, uh, campfire tales.

[00:52:49] And it's again, the first in a series, it's the campfire tales. And this one subtitle is the cursed campground. So that was a lot of fun because, uh, I'd written novels before, like young reader novels for Marvel back in the day. I wrote a couple of Spider-Man ones, right?

[00:53:07] Um, which were very short. These are a little bit longer cause they're a middle grade novels. So it was a lot of fun. So check that out. Yeah. It comes out March 4th. It's a FGTV campfire tales, the cursed campground. Oh, nice. Yeah. I just, I was just looking up, uh, yeah. Funnel vision and FGTV and yes, they, I, I have seen them when I look over my kid's shoulders and ask, why are you still on YouTube guys?

[00:53:35] Yeah. Yeah. They, they have millions of millions and millions of followers. So everyone's kids probably know who they are. So I get, whenever I have, um, their other books, cause I've been working with them for years now. Uh huh. Whenever I have any other graphic novels on my table, kids are like, Oh, this is the one that I needed. I have all the other ones. I'm like, yeah, of course you do. Like everybody knows the FGTV, you know, it's a very popular thing right now.

[00:54:00] They even have a game at Chuck E. Cheese now. Uh, it's based on one of the graphic novels, FGTV at a time, the time travel story. So check that out. All right. Yeah. That sounds great. Um, so that's out March 4th, March 4th. Yeah. Oh, fantastic. Um, well, Joe, I, uh, really appreciate you coming on the podcast. Um, I, I've been following you on social media for a while. I mean,

[00:54:28] I know we've been talking for years. Yeah. I'm glad I'm finally here. Yeah, I am too. Um, you know, are you still, uh, you still getting into donuts? I hope. Oh yeah. Always. I'm trying to cut back a little bit just because I was on such donut overload after, uh, you know, from a couple of years back when I did the 204 trips to Krispy Kreme. Right. Yep. So that was a lot. I was, I was rooting for you.

[00:54:56] Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. You raised money for charity, which is phenomenal. I did. Yeah. We raised about 3000. I don't know the exact number anymore, but it's not on the top of my mind anymore, but over $3,000. And then, uh, I went on the Drew Barrymore show and they kicked in an additional $10,000. So yeah, that was awesome. Yeah. That was, it was worth all the donuts. Yeah, absolutely. For sure. If you ever make your way to, to, to Delaware, North Wilmington again, we got a, there's a great

[00:55:25] little donut shop near me called sleeping bird donuts that make, if you're into fancy donuts, they, they do. So, so if you ever in town, fancy donuts on me, uh, all right. All right. Yeah. You got it. You got it. If you have any, uh, conventions coming up down there, you know, tell them to give me a call and I'll come back. I'll let you know. Oh, actually I should try and talk to them. Just talk to people at my shop to see if they can, if they're interested in,

[00:55:52] if you're available to come down for a signing, uh, cause that'd be great to see. Definitely. I'm, I'm game. There's a lot, a lot, they have a great kids section and I'm sure space chasers will look great amongst all the other books there. So. Oh, for sure. Yeah. Maybe we can make that happen and then we'll, we'll get some sleeping bird donuts. So there you go. Sounds good. All right, Joe, thank you so much. Uh, listeners, uh, this has been Joe Caramagna for, uh,

[00:56:17] uh, comic book and Jimmy Gasparo for comic book, Yeti space chasers that he wrote with Leland Melvin and art by Alison Acton is out February 4th. And then the FGTV, um, the, uh, campfire tales, uh, middle grade novels out March 4th. And, uh, if you haven't read any of Joe's duck tail stuff, go look at it. It's just, it's so good. You, I'm sure you can find it. The, I mean, the, the issues are just absolutely wonderful if you're a duck tail span, but really so much

[00:56:47] fun to write too. Yeah. Uh, it, it, it seemed like it because the stories are just incredible, but, uh, thank you. I appreciate it. So listeners happy new year. And, uh, I hope, uh, you know, year 2025 is off to a good start. If let me know, uh, what you were reading, what comics you're checking out, I really appreciate you listening. Um, and I'll see you next time. Good night. This is Byron O'Neill, one of your hosts of the Cryptid Creator Corner brought to you by

[00:57:16] Comic Book Yeti. We hope you've enjoyed this episode of our podcast. Please rate, review, subscribe, all that good stuff. It lets us know how we're doing and more importantly, how we can improve. Thanks for listening. If you enjoyed this episode of the Cryptid Creator Corner, maybe you would enjoy our sister podcast Into the Comics Cave. Listen and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.