Joe Eisma Interview - Student Government

[00:00:00] Your ears do not deceive you. You've just entered the Cryptid Creator Corner brought to you by your friends at Comic Book Yeti. So without further ado, let's get on to the interview. Hey everyone, this is... Hi Byron. Who is this? I'm your fairy godmother. I have a fairy godmother? Of course you do. I'm 50 years old, why haven't you shown up before? I appear when I'm needed. And I didn't need you in all these years? Do you want my help or not? Um...

[00:00:30] Sure. Exactly. I was just about to pitch our Patreon. Why would I need help with that? Because you're an idiot sometimes. That's hurtful. What were you going to put on there? We do comic stuff? So something along those lines? And this is why I'm here. You do know what people put on Patreon most of the time, right? Honestly, no. People need something a little bit spicy to entice them to support you.

[00:00:59] Nobody wants to see me shirtless. I doubt that's true. You are in pretty good shape considering your age. Thank you. Let's see. A little spicy. I've been bugging Jimmy to figure out what he's going to do. I know lately he's been playing around with his **** all the time. He loves to take it out and show it off. There's even a specific TikTok channel now. How's that sound? Not a bad start. People like Jimmy. What else you got?

[00:01:24] I told a story recently about being in a strip club with some of the four horsemen when I was working for WCW back in the day. I picked up an infection on my- Woo! From the experience, I hate strip clubs. Is that better? Getting there. But maybe spicy shouldn't include infections you get in strip clubs. That's not sexy. We'll workshop it. Like I need more meating. At least tell them where to find it while we figure this out. Mother goddess, help this poor man.

[00:01:53] You can find us on Patreon at cryptidcreatorcornerpod. I'll put it in the show notes. Anything else you'd like to remind me that I'm bad at? How much time do you have? Why do you look like Rosario Dawson anyway? I appear the way you want me to look. Okay, that's disturbing. Wait, have you been showing up in my dreams? I'll never tell. And we're done here. Y'all, Jimmy the Chaos Goblin strikes again.

[00:02:20] I should have known better than to mention I was working on my DC Universe meets Ravenloft hybrid D&D campaign on social media. My bad. He goes and tags a bunch of comics creators we know, and now I have to get it in gear and whip this campaign into shape so we can start playing. Another friend chimes in, are you going to make maps? It's fair to say it's been a while since I put something together, so I guess, question mark? It was then that I discovered Arkhamforge.

[00:02:45] If you don't know who Arkhamforge is, they have everything you need to make your TTRPG more fun and immersive. Allowing you to build, play, and export animated maps, including in-person Fog of War capability that lets your players interact with maps as the adventure unfolds while you, the DM, get the full picture. Now I'm set to easily build high-res animated maps, saving myself precious time and significantly adding nuance to our campaign. That's a win every day in my book.

[00:03:14] Check them out at arkhamforge.com and use the discount code YETI5 to get $5 off. I'll drop a link in the show notes for you. And big thanks to Arkhamforge for partnering with our show. I think I'm going to make Jimmy play a goblin gorlok just to get even. Hello and welcome to Comic Book Yeti's Cryptid Creator Corner. I'm one of your hosts, Jimmy Gasparo. And I am so excited to talk to today's guest because I'm a huge fan.

[00:03:39] And we'll probably talk about Vault Comics Engine Word a little bit, which I absolutely loved. And so my guests today, they also were the artist and co-creator of Morning Glories. They've done a bunch of comics. They have a new book that they're involved with coming out March 11th through Mad Cave Studios' Maverick imprint. It's called Student Government. It sounds great.

[00:04:06] I think it's also involving Lila Sturgis and Dave Justice. We're going to hear all about it. But please welcome to the podcast, Joe Eisbeth. Joe, how are you doing today? I'm great, Jimmy. Thanks for having me. No, I'm so excited. You know, I do this because I just like talking to people about comics. And when I, you know, can have somebody on whose work that I'm a fan of and can really express that.

[00:04:33] I just, I loved Engine Word. I'm so glad. I collected it. I got all, you know, 12 issues. I just thought it was a very, one, I loved this, the story of it. But I mean, your artwork was just great. Like some of those, you know, the character designs. And for listeners, if you don't know about Engine Word, it was a vault comic series. It was 12 issues.

[00:04:57] Each issue kind of focused on a different character that represented somebody in the Zodiac, let's say. It's about these folks on this planet. They kind of have these, there's representatives of the Zodiac who are kind of like rulers, kind of like gods. And the one main character is called like an engine word. She's kind of like an engineer. People start going missing in the town. They go on this great adventure.

[00:05:27] I won't spoil anything else. But as this complex story kind of unravels over these, these 12 issues. I mean, I just thought it was woven together, together beautifully. I thought it was something that totally stuck the landing and paid off on the promise of the series. And I mean, a large part of that was like your, your artwork, you know, there was just so many like very interesting things about it.

[00:05:55] Some of the designs, I think. Also, I don't know. I don't think it was the cover. I think it was like one of the maybe the opening pages, but I probably was with like Pisces. But there was like, maybe it was the cover where the, like you kind of had the watery outline and you could see through it. There were just so many like, like so many interesting things that were, that were done. I totally fell in love with the series.

[00:06:23] And yeah, I just thought it was phenomenal. So that's my commercial for my, for engine word. Everybody, if you haven't read it, you can go get it. But they also collected all 12 issues and like a really nice addition. I think you can still find, but yeah. So. Well, thank you. I mean, like that was such a labor of love engine ward. And I mean, I have to give major props to George Mann, the writer who crafted this just amazing story.

[00:06:52] And Adrian was also at vaults who just kind of let me run wild, you know, let me just go crazy. Like there were things I was like, is it okay if I try this? He's like, yeah, go ahead. And, you know, it was a true collaboration because I got to do things I'd never really done before. Because, you know, comics, there's kind of a thing about, you do get a little bit typecast. And I was kind of the, the teen horror drama guy, you know, from morning glories through the Archie stuff.

[00:07:22] And engine ward was a genre, a kind of a field that I haven't really got to crack yet. And I was so happy to get to do that and to be able to just let my creativity flow and have a real say in the design of everything from the world to the characters to the covers. It was just great. And George and I worked really closely a lot on like a lot of the layouts, like a lot of the layouts.

[00:07:48] And there were things I wouldn't have normally done on my own had I not, you know, collaborated with George and Adrian on this. I know there was one sequence where like the characters were like on this caravan to like go through the wilderness. And it was like, the double page spread was like a sun, like the hours of the day. And that kind of started with George. And, you know, I kind of, you know, helped kind of guide it. But yeah, like that, that was so much fun.

[00:08:16] Like that book was my love letter to my nerd stuff, which is like the games of Square Enix. Like Final Fantasy and Chrono Trigger. So much of the designs in that book were kind of influenced by that. And it was just a great opportunity to to work with Michael Garland, who did the colors. He just did such a brilliant job on the colors.

[00:08:42] Michael was someone that I had been after for a long time to work on Morning Glories, but we didn't get a chance to make that happen. And so when Injun Ward came up and I, I, I literally saw him out. I was like, can you please do this? I would love to have you. And he did. And he colored every single issue. I was so glad. And it looks beautiful. It's still, you know, one of my all time favorite series that I've worked on just because everything about that book, I felt like hit, you know? Oh, yeah.

[00:09:11] No, as a fan of it, I agree. And it's one of those things that I love where it's, you know, a weird mix of, because you're talking kind of like interplanetary stuff where you always have a sense of like science fiction and the future. But you are also dealing with like limited resources. So, you know, there's, there's a weird mix of elements where you can, you can see almost like a, like, like a homesteading kind of like Western element to it.

[00:09:41] Science fiction. There's like a quest involved, very, you know, fantasy heavy. So, yeah. And it all blended very well. Well, thank you. So, yeah, I, I, I think I, if anyone ever, you know, asked for comic recommendations, that is still always at the top of my list if folks haven't read it, because I just, I head over heels for that series. So, well, I can't thank you enough.

[00:10:07] You're always like, especially when we launched, I mean, you've always been such a great cheerleader for that book. And we were always so grateful to have you like, you know, touting the book, you know, and it was just so nice. Like the one thing that that was so bad about the book was that we launched, you know, 2020, you know, right. So the pandemic, and it sucks because like when we were planning the launch, you know, because I had started the work on this book in like 2019.

[00:10:38] And, you know, we were, we have these plans. We were going to launch it, San Diego Comic-Con 2020. We were going to have a big event. And of course, none of that happened. But so the fact that it even came out at all is, I feel like a miracle unto itself. Like any comic that I ever worked on, I feel is a miracle. But like that one, especially given the circumstances. But that's the one thing I wish was different because like, you know, there was, there's so much about that, that I feel like.

[00:11:06] Like, you know, COVID just kind of knocked the wind out of everybody. But that one especially is like, I feel like it just didn't get its time in the sun. And I wish more people would, you know, check it out. And, you know, I feel it flew under the radar quite a bit. Yeah, I know.

[00:11:24] I got that sense too, which is one of the reasons I would have, you know, trying at least in my little corner of social media to shout about it because I just didn't feel like, you know, for, I just didn't feel like a enough folks were talking about it. And especially for the things that I like, it just hit, you know, so many of those elements because it's like a really kind of complex, like rich story.

[00:11:52] It can, look, if you don't want to, if you're that type of person that just likes surface level stuff, your artwork's gorgeous. You're right. Michael Barlin's colors work so well with your art. And you could just go and like, oh, it's a fun adventure. But I mean, it also has so many layers. There's, you know, political, socioeconomic elements to it that you can like dig in.

[00:12:16] It is, it is, you know, all of you together have created like a rich tapestry of this story. So I feel like it was one of my, I mean, favorite comics in the past, you know, decade. Yeah, that's great. I've read. Yeah. Yeah. And just a really great, you know, 12 issue story, you know, start to finish. That's what I like.

[00:12:41] I like, cause like, this is the thing that I talk about with my wife a lot, like in the kind of media that we consume, whether it's TV shows or animation is, I love a good serialized story that, you know, goes on for many seasons or whatever. But I also have an appreciation for a story that knows, you know, start and finish that has a resolution.

[00:13:32] So I mean, if, if, even if it's not engine board too, and at least another opportunity to work with George would be great. Yeah. We have the two of you together. My, I would, I fully endorse that. Awesome. But, but let's, let's turn a little bit because I mentioned earlier, March 11th student government. Yes. I'm a big fan. Anyone who listens to the podcast knows that I, I'm a big mad cave and, and Maverick fan.

[00:13:59] And I, I've, you know, the past year or so I've had a number of creators on, especially, you know, recently with mad caves 10th anniversary year. Mm-hmm. I feel like they have just, they're, they're just done some fantastic stuff in terms of the books they're putting out. Also in terms of, you know, um, uh, some of the other, like, I hate when I call things IP.

[00:14:21] I don't like to do that, but I can't think of a better word right now, but you know, Flash Gordon and like Dick Tracy and like kind of they're reviving, you know, those things as well, along with the creator and stuff that they're doing. And I, I think some of the Maverick books they're putting out the past few years, um, have been, you know, absolutely, uh, incredible. Um, so super excited for student government. This sounds like a great series.

[00:14:50] Um, I, I, I just kind of read like the little blurb about it, that it sounds like there's like four students that are essentially trying to save their school. Yep. I think they're exploiting like a loophole in the charter or something to save their school from demolition. But why don't you tell our listeners, you know, a little bit more about what they can expect with student government? Sure. So you, you basically got the summary, the summary right there. It's, uh, these four students, they're kind of like the, the losers or whatever. Uh, they're the interim student government.

[00:15:18] So they're there between the fall and spring semesters. They, they don't go home for the holidays. So they're there with the, is the interim student government. And they, their school is basically, it's like a new England private school. Like imagine it's in Rhode Island. So imagine like the Harvard and the Brown and all those kinds of universities, very old school, uh, university.

[00:15:40] But, um, they find this loophole in their charter, uh, which I don't want to spoil, but, uh, they found a way to kind of save their school from demolition. Uh, and it very much, uh, it's, it's a humor book. It's really lighthearted and, um, not dark at all, but in any way, like compared to the stuff I've done before.

[00:16:01] Um, but like the best way I can kind of like give a, uh, uh, an allegory to this is sort of like, you know, if you remember like eighties comedy movies, you know, those, those, uh, teen comedy movies, you're like, we got to save the school kind of thing. Or, you know, uh, better off dead kind of vibe, uh, something like that. Like that it's very much in that wheelhouse. Okay. Now I love better off. I love better off dead. Oh, I know. So, I mean, this is written by Lila Sturgis and Dave Justice, who are some of my oldest friends.

[00:16:31] And, um, we, we've actually known each other. Like I said, there's some of my oldest friends. We met at a free comic book day here in Dallas where I'm from, um, in 2009. And, um, we just hung out. We were just, we hit it off. And just through the years, we tried making things work. You know, a couple of pitches. I did a, an issue for a series that they did set up at another publisher that went, that ended up folding. So, uh, we tried to, you know, another pitch and that didn't work. And then student government, uh, we worked on.

[00:17:01] And it's funny because, uh, they came to me and my other book that I'm most known for is Morning Glories, which is set in a private school. Um, they're like, we have this pitch. We don't know if you want to read it because it takes place in a school. And I was like, let me read it because I know them so well. And I've always, I like working with the two of them. And, uh, it just, it was so charming. Uh, it was so funny. And I was like, yes, let's do this.

[00:17:25] And we sent it around and Mad Cave and Maverick, uh, were just like so ecstatic about it when they got it. And they helped us kind of shape it because originally like Dave and Lila's humor, uh, it can be pretty, uh, crass at times. Um, so, uh, Mike Martz at Mad Cave and Lauren Hitsuzin, who's our editor, uh, they kind of helped us shape it. Lauren was like, this is a YA book. Like, why don't you take this instead of like get a mature reader's book?

[00:17:55] Like, let's make it a YA, a young adult graphic novel. And that, that was like the, the, the key and that like totally solidified it. That made everything kind of come together. And, um, I don't know, this is like, you know, there's certain projects you work on, or at least as a creator, like for me, like morning glories and engine ward. And now this one where like the creative team, everything kind of comes together and it has this like electric feel to it. And this was one of them. And I was just so, I'm so ecstatic for this.

[00:18:24] I'm so happy. Uh, this is like the longest graphic novel I've ever worked on. Um, it's 188 pages. Oh, okay. Wow. Which is shocking because our editor, she told us is like, when they started writing, they're like, okay, our hard stop is 180 pages. So if y'all can do less than that. And they ended up going like eight pages over, which I felt hilarious. But, um, but yeah, I mean, it's, it's, I mean, I hate to say it's not totally a comedy.

[00:18:51] It's very much, um, you know, I mean, there's still like some drama aspects to it. And, uh, there's a lot of character, uh, stuff. And Dave and Lila wrote some really just well-flashed out characters. Um, it's got a lot of heart to it. It's very, uh, heartwarming story, uh, in some regards. But the humor is one thing that really attracted me to it because that's something that I love to draw. Like, I love the sci-fi stuff. Like, Injun Ward will always be like, I want to do more in that vein.

[00:19:21] Yeah. And of course, like, Morning Glory is like the horror aspect. I love that. Uh, but humor is something that I just really love to do. Um, and I don't, there's not a whole lot of comics that incorporate humor. Um, so. Well, it's, it's hard. It is. It is extremely difficult. It's difficult. That's what I've learned. I've learned that it is so difficult to pull off humor in a comic, which is why you don't see it as much. Um, I've been lucky to work with a few writers that I feel like have nailed it. Like, I worked with John Lehman.

[00:19:50] Uh, we did Charlie's Angels at Dynamite. And his scripts, I felt, were genuinely funny. And they weren't like, you know, kind of hacky, kind of funny stuff. But, like, he just wrote, like, actual, like, genuine humor. And Dave and Lila wrote some really genuinely funny jokes. Because they say that there's two genres that are really hard to pull off, which are humor and horror. Because, like, just because of the reactions you want to elicit in the reader, viewer, whatever. Yeah.

[00:20:17] And, uh, those are kind of both of, like, my favorite genres. So, um, but yeah, like, it's a really great book. I'm super excited about it. And, um, it's not like anything I've done before, really. Oh, awesome. Um, yeah, I mean, I think horror is hard in terms of a comic. Because so much of horror depends on, you know, pacing. Mm-hmm. Um, and building tension.

[00:20:42] And which, there are, not tricks, but, you know, there are things you can do in a comic, if done well. But you can try and use the page turn sometimes. But it's difficult when, like, things are all laid down on the page. Your eye might catch something. And, you know, you... Give it away. Yeah. Or some people might say, like, a jump scare is kind of, like, a cheap thrill in terms of horror. But you kind of lose some of that. So, unless you're going for something really gory, you know, horror can be tough.

[00:21:12] But, similarly, humor is tough, you know, you... Because so much of humor is dependent upon timing. You know, whether or not you're watching a sitcom or a stand-up comedian, there's also elements of, you know, tone in terms of how a joke might be said. Which you, you kind of lose all of that. Oh, yeah. Um, so, I mean, is that the challenge? Is there something else in terms of when you get something and you're like, oh, this is a really great, like, written joke.

[00:21:42] What do you have to do to figure out how you're going to, like, lay out the panel so that a punchline lands? Like, what is that approach like? That's a great question. And that's the challenge. That's, like, the biggest part of the work there. So, one thing that kind of informs the way I draw, not just humor, but just in general, is I really love, like, caricature art. And so, caricature art is all about exaggeration.

[00:22:11] You know, you focus on a feature of someone and you exaggerate it. And you play it up for laughs. And so, uh, with comics, um, I, I kind of try to approach it in the same way. Like, especially with just comics in general, because comics is a two-dimensional medium. You're reading a 2D thing. It's representing a three-dimensional world. And so, you've got to do what you can to make the panels, the characters, they kind of need to come to life.

[00:22:38] And so, exaggeration is the key to that. Um, and this is like, because I teach part-time. I teach art part-time is I always try to tell my students, like, gesture, exaggeration. Like, that will make your characters more lively, uh, feel more natural. And so, when I'm getting a humorous scene or whatever, like, I'm always, you know, I'm very cognizant of, like, the pacing and the timing. And so, like, how the characters are acting in each panel. Um, I try to, like, view them as, like, actual actors.

[00:23:07] Like, how would I direct them? Like, how they would conduct themselves in each shot. And so, you know, they need to be this way for this main panels so that the payoff on the joke panel will actually work or whatever. And so, a lot of that is through, like, expression and body language. And that's where, that's what I bring to it. Like, the writers, they bring through the words, you know, the joke itself. And then, of course, the setup.

[00:23:33] Um, and, like, my, my contribution to kind of, you know, bring that over the top is to try and, like, you know, use exaggeration and gesture and expressions on their face to really, you know, uh, you know, nail that joke. And so, like, that's what I work on with every, you know, humorous scene or whatever. And that, like, and that stuff is, it's challenging, but it's, it's fun for me.

[00:24:00] Yeah. Yeah. Um, I, you mentioned Better Off Dead. Like, is that, what are some of the, like, cornerstones of your, you know, sense of humor? Like, what, what informs it either whether or not it's, you know, TV or film or a comic or art? You know, what, what, what has kind of, what has helped you the most develop your sense of humor? Yeah. So, uh, the director of Better Off Dead was a guy named Savage Steve Holland.

[00:24:27] And he did, I mean, I like Better Off Dead, but, uh, my favorite movie of his is one called One Crazy Summer. One crazy, yeah. I watched that movie so many times. It's so absurd. Like, so, like, my, my, my favorite kind of humor is, like, the absurd kind of humor. And so, like, okay. Like, it's just ridiculous. And, like, you know, that whole movie is so ridiculous over the top. If you haven't watched it, like, I encourage, you know, anyone to watch it. It's so funny. John Cusack and Demi Moore, they're, they're just great.

[00:24:56] I love the Pink Panther films. Uh, Peter Sellers, uh, is Inspector Clouseau. Uh, I study all the scenes that he's in, uh, for, like, the way he, you know, his, the way he plays the scene. He's like, he's like a living cartoon compared to everyone else in the scene who's trying to play it straight. But he's so cartoonish and over the top, you know? So, like, that's kind of, that influences me. Um, I love shows like C-Lab 2021. That's, I'm dating myself. Okay.

[00:25:25] Yeah, Adult Swim, the early 2000s, Aqua Teen, C-Lab, uh, you know, Metalocalypse or whatever. I loved all that stuff. Okay. I, uh, yeah. I was, I kind of missed the, um, I think, because I'm in my mid-40s, so, um. Oh, so am I. Yeah. Like, yeah, I kind of missed a lot of the, um, the Adult Swim stuff.

[00:25:48] I just, I, I, it, but, but for whatever reason, I happened to catch a handful of episodes of Aqua Teen, Hunger Force. And out of all the, all the things that, you know, come into my, come into your brain and out, there's, like, one particular line of Aqua Teen, Hunger Force, I think, where they give the, the neighbor, like, a bunch of, a bunch of laxatives. And I don't know why, but, and Meatwad says, like, that man gonna poop himself inside out.

[00:26:18] And I just, like. It's, like, so spot on. What? It's just, I just think of it, like, all the time. The amount of times that this one episode of Aqua Teen, Hunger Force, I've seen. That's great. Yeah, like, my brother's, Bobby, I, I shout out Bobby every episode. He's the Cryptid Creator Corner's number one most dedicated fan. Bobby listens to all my episodes. I say that every, every podcast.

[00:26:41] But Bobby's lactose intolerant, and every time he has, like, something with milk or cheese and he doesn't have his lactate, I always just instantly go. That man gonna poop and surf inside out. Oh, my God. Wow. That's great, man. In any event. Sorry for that digression. No, no, perfect. I mean, it's great. Yeah, so, you know, just, just, like, ridiculous, absurd humor is what really resonates with me.

[00:27:07] And, you know, I mean, I grew up in the 80s, and I was a teenager in the 90s, so, you know, I loved Beavis and Butthead and the early South Park, too. So, like, those kinds of things were, were big influences on me. And, like, not necessarily, because, I mean, like, like, Beavis and Butthead is not very well drawn. And, which I'm sure they would all admit to.

[00:27:31] But, like, just the, you know, everything about that show, like, the aesthetic that they created, like, it works for that, that kind of, you know, humor. And, also, the fact that that one and King of the Hill, like, they're both kind of, like, you know, I mean, same creator, my judge. But they're both kind of set in Dallas, basically, where I'm from. Like, I can literally, like, the town that King of the Hill is set in is literally, like, 10 miles down the road from where I live.

[00:28:01] And it's, like, so surreal to, like, like, I know it's a cartoon, but, like, I know it's, like, oh, I can totally see where he got some of the ideas for these locations. It's because it's, like, it looks just like this area, you know. So, but. Yeah, Mike Judge is pretty, you know, pretty important with Beavis and, you know, Beavis and the King of the Hill. But he also, like, idiocracy. In office space. In office space, absolutely. Yeah, like, I finally got my wife to watch that movie a couple months ago, and she just loved it.

[00:28:30] And it's, like, that's, like, you know, that's one of the all times for me is, like, is office space. Because, like, that movie's, first of all, like, it's so underrated anyway. But, like, and it's another one that flew under a lot. A lot of people's radar. I'm, like, how have you not seen office space? It's so great. It's a classic. Yeah. I agree.

[00:28:47] Yeah, that was, it was, like, that was one of those, you know, very quotable movies to, like, you know, us movie, couple of us, my friends who were, like, movie nerds who thought, you know, we were cool because we saw, we could quote clerks in office space. Oh, yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah.

[00:29:05] Um, and so when you, you know, when you look at getting involved in, like, a project like this, like, how good are you in terms of, like, you know, budgeting your time, you know, because you're looking at, oh, I'm drawing, like, you know, 180. 180, well, eventually, I guess, 188 page book. Like, um, yeah, well, what does that look like in terms of the timing of it?

[00:29:32] Like, you know, because I think sometimes, um, I get questions and listeners, you know, how long does it really take to make a comic book? So when you, are you involved in the process, like, early on, like, in terms of while they're, they're still scripting and, like, sending you stuff? Or are you handed a script and you're like, all right, well, we'll wait to give you notes. What is it like? Uh, yes. All of the above. Okay. Because, like, every project I've worked on is different.

[00:30:01] So, like, a lot of the work for hire stuff, you know, I'm kind of brought into that. And it depends on the project, you know, I may be able to do, like, character designs and, uh, or if it's, like, Star Trek, you know, like, it's already established, you know, I just have to, like, be able to get likenesses. But, um, student government in particular was unlike any project I've ever worked on because of the fact that, uh, Dave and Lila were both pretty local to me. So, like I said, I'm in the Dallas area and, uh, in Texas.

[00:30:29] And Dave and Lila, uh, well, Lila lives in Portland now, but they were both at the time in Austin, which is about a three and a half hour drive south of me. Um, and Dave's, uh, mom lives near me anyway. So, like, they came up, uh, one weekend and they spent the weekend with me. And I've never done this. I had my iPad. They had their laptops. They were writing. We were, like, kind of throwing ideas back and forth. And we created characters. I drew them on the spot. Oh, wow.

[00:30:59] I've never done this because a lot of times it's all through email, you know? Like, I'll connect with the writer and be like, okay, here's, like, my basic pitch. I'll send in some character sketches. We'll go through them. A little bit back and forth. It's all electronic. This is the first time I've actually got to kind of create something from the ground up with the writers in the same room. And it was, that's why I feel like this book has, like, an energy to it that none of my other books have. Because, like, I was a lot more hands-on involved.

[00:31:27] And there's a couple of characters that, you know, they had kind of, quote-unquote, sketched out, you know, in their heads, like, you know, that they had written out. And I fleshed them out. I was like, well, what if they do this? You know, because I'm half Filipino. And I was like, why don't we make them Filipino? And, like, that hadn't occurred to them. And so, like, I drew these characters. And, like, okay, now we understand who these characters are just based on, like, your drawing. And so that kind of helped them write the characters. And, like, that was, like, such a joy. But, yeah, like, every project's different.

[00:31:57] But, like, you know, I would love to be able to do more of these where I could connect with the writer in person for a few days. It would be just, like, you know, I could draw. They could write. We could just kind of throw ideas back and forth. But, I mean, it's not feasible because we're all over the world. Like, Injimor George is in the U.K. Right. Neither one of us can be, like, flying back and forth, you know.

[00:32:20] But, yeah, I mean, but it's very rare that there's a project that the collaboration isn't, you know, ideal or it doesn't work. But there's some that just click more than others. And, you know, this one and Injimor and Morning Glories are all ones that just kind of really came together. Nice.

[00:32:42] Yeah, it is interesting, you know, to hear when, you know, if the writer or, you know, whoever it is on a project has an idea for a character. And then, like, you kind of, you know, with comics, you kind of, the artist kind of starts to really sketch it out. And how either the personality or that, you know, the character's arc kind of, like, clicks, you know, into place when you actually see it.

[00:33:10] When, you know, that image you might have in your mind kind of starts to get, you know, fleshed out. Along with those other details and, like, you know, and the character arc. I mean, that is just kind of, that's one of, like, the great things about, you know, about comics when that starts to happen. Yeah, I agree. I mean, that's why I stay in this business because, like, it's kind of thankless. You know, I mean, and it's very solitary. I'm, you know, I'm just in my office all day by myself for the most part.

[00:33:42] And, you know, it can get a little, I mean, it can get kind of isolating feeling. I mean, I used to do, back in the days when people used Skype. I don't know if you want to remember Skype. I used to get on Skype calls with other artists and we would just chat and draw at the same time, you know. I mean, it'd be lots of dead air and stuff. But, I mean, we'd just have it on in the background and we'd just be drawing. And that was nice. But, because I don't, I don't, I'm not part of a studio or anything. I'm just myself, you know.

[00:34:11] But, you know, this is what I love to do. You know, I used to, like, my workload, like, because I was just doing more Inglories for a while. And, like, I really, you know, it's difficult for an artist to branch out and do multiple projects. Writers, it's easier because, you know, and I'm not down talking writers or whatever. But you're single-handedly starting the writers verse. I know, I know. Artist discourse.

[00:34:40] But mathematics is, it's a lot less time-consuming to write a page than to draw a page. Yeah, you're right. So, like, a lot of the writers I've worked with are working on multiple books. And I'm like, I just have this, you know, so I want to do multiple. Sure. So, like, I started taking on lots of books. And, like, it actually did negatively affect my health for a while because, like, I would be getting up at, like, because I have two sons. They're older now. They're 12 and 16.

[00:35:05] But, you know, years ago they were a lot younger and I had to, you know, do a lot of the, you know, care for them. And so I would be getting up at, like, 435 to work a little bit before getting them ready for school or whatever. And then working a little bit and then picking them up from school, hanging out with them, making them food, dinner, and then spending time with them, putting them to bed, and then working late into the night, you know. So that was just, I was burning the candle at both ends.

[00:35:34] And so when I got married to my wife a few years ago, she's like, you know, you need to just, you know, reevaluate because you're just, you're like, you're so stressed out. And so now I, like, I keep pretty standard office hours, like, you know, in the office at, like, 839 and out at 5, Monday through Friday. I mean, occasionally I'll have to opt to work, like, a day of the weekend.

[00:35:56] But I try, but, like, keeping those boundaries, like, keeping those standard, like, everybody else's 9 to 5 hours or whatever has done such a, you know, an amazing job on, like, not only my physical but my mental health. And I feel like my work has improved just because I've gotten to be a little bit more regimented about my schedule. So, like, and that, it took a lot of time and work to get to that point. And not everybody can do that. And so I know how lucky I am to be able to, like, be in a position where, because, like, my kids are older now.

[00:36:25] So, like, they're in school more and I don't have to, like, you know, they're not doing as many extracurriculars. I don't have to go to soccer practice and t-ball and all that stuff. So it's much easier now where I'm at now to, like, focus on my work and really put a lot more TLC into my pages. Right. Yeah, I mean, the phrase, like, work-life balance is kind of, like, you know, kind of buzzwords. But it is, like, hugely important.

[00:36:53] And, like, as you said, like, it does, it can affect not just, like, your mental health but your physical health. So that, you know, it's definitely important to do that and take care of yourself. Yeah. I'm curious, you know, with you, because I'm reading up and preparing for the interview, that you were kind of on a different track in terms of, like, it was something still creative. But I think it was more like TV and film.

[00:37:21] And then did you, what, graduate from Baylor and then went back to a different school for art creation? Yeah. Is that what happened? Yeah. So I, boy, when I went to college, it was one of those, like, I had no idea what I was going to do, you know? So I went to film school. And I worked in TV production and hated it.

[00:37:45] But I remembered, because I always drew, but, like, I kind of stopped when I got to high school because, like, this is terrible. Like, when I got to high school, I discovered, like, first of all, I was like, it takes too long to draw. Like, I was like, I fully realized that because it started taking me, like, an entire day to draw a page, you know, basically. And my 16-year-old self, I was like, no, that's lame. I don't want to do that. So I picked up the guitar.

[00:38:12] And the girls, girls liked the guitar more than the comic page. So I was like. Yeah. That tracks. Guitar more. I know, right? So I kind of stopped drawing for, like, a decade. Oh, wow. Yeah. So I studied film. I played in a band. And I did all that. But then, you know, post-college, I was, like, just not happy with what I was doing. And I was like, I've always drawn.

[00:38:40] Like, and there was a new program that was doing art for game design. And I love video games. So I went to this grad program for that. And I worked in game development independently for 10 years for a local developer here in Dallas. We just did, like, it was like an indie developer. So it was basically, like, you know, a smaller developer for iPhone and Nintendo DS. If anybody remembers the Nintendo DS. Oh, yeah.

[00:39:09] But I did that for a while. But, like, that also ended up developing to a point where I was like, I'm not really satisfied with this. Because I was literally just getting a list of things to make, having no creative contribution. So that's when I started kind of drawing comics on the side. And eventually the comics kind of took over. So I left games. I haven't done games in, like, well over, like, you know, 10, 12 years, something like that.

[00:39:38] But, yeah, I've had this really weird career path from starting out in film and then going to games and now into comics. Right. And teaching now, too, right? Yeah, yeah. And I teach, like, part-time occasionally just because it's fun. It gets me out of the house, which my family loves. Because eventually I start to turn into, like, you know, a hermit or whatever. And they're like, you need to go spend some time outside a little bit. Right. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:40:07] What kind of stuff do you do? You know, I hear, you know, other creative people, whether or not it's a writer or an artist, like, get to a point. Not necessarily, like, writer's block or art block. But sometimes, you know, it's referred to as, like, the well. The well might, like, run dry and you need to, like, replenish it. Like, are there things that you do, whether or not it's, like, read somebody else's comics or play a video game? Oh, yeah. Go to a museum. Or what are those types of things for you now, you know, as someone like me in your 40s with,

[00:40:35] with two kids and trying to manage all this stuff? Do you still have time to do those things? And, like, if you do, what are they? All of the above. Yeah. I love video games. I, like, COVID really reignited my love of playing video games. Because, like, as soon as, I feel like it was almost as soon as lockdown happened, Final Fantasy 7 remake came out.

[00:40:59] And, like, so I kind of associate, like, my escape from the stress of the pandemic with playing Final Fantasy 7 remake. And then I just kind of, I went back and I played, you know, God of War 2018. And I just went and played Horizon Zero Dawn and did all these other, like, you know, great single player, you know, action adventure games. And so, like, rediscovering games. Because, like, when I was working in games, like, I wasn't really doing, I wasn't doing anything on that level.

[00:41:27] I mean, we're talking, like, really old school style stuff. But it was almost like I'd seen how the sausage was made and it kind of took the luster of video games away from me. Because I was, like, I started to look at games and be, like, I could, all right, so I understand where this is. And I understand, like, this is just a 3D model and, like, whatever. And, obviously, we know it's 3D models. But, like, it just kind of, I started to look at it not as a fan but, like, as just someone who worked in it and was, like, not able to enjoy it.

[00:41:56] So, like, I've had enough time away from it now that I can enjoy it again. So, I play games and I get, like, re-inspired, you know. And I play, like, the Final Fantasy games, any RPG, you know, I play. And it's just, it's great. It just kind of reignites my creativity. And, yeah, that and, you know, watching shows. I love anime and animation. Blue Eye Samurai came out a year ago or something.

[00:42:27] Oh, my God. One of the most gorgeous animated series I've seen recently. And another one that flew under the radar. Like, I tell people, like, have you seen Blue Eye Samurai? Like, what is that? And I'm, like, it's so good. It's on Netflix. You got to watch it. And, yeah, I didn't hear. I don't know that one. I'll have to check it out. Yeah, and it's really, and it's, I mean, it's not a, you know, it's not a one and done story. They're going to do a season two. But, I mean, it's like eight episodes. And, you know, they make every second, every frame count. And it's beautifully animated.

[00:42:56] Great art style. So, yeah, that stuff just, like, reignites me. So, yeah, gaming and just, like, looking for, like, animation. And, you know, I don't get to go out to movies as much as I would like to. And, of course, there's not as many great movies out anymore. But it used to be I would go see films with, like, my favorite directors. And that would, you know, really inspire me. But, yeah, it's really just down to games and shows now. Nice. Are those things that your kids enjoy with you? Or are they, like, that's dad stuff?

[00:43:26] No, no. There's some of them that we can watch together. Oh, good. And then there's some games that we both like together. Like, both of my kids just complete, both, each on their own, finished Ghost of Tsushima on PlayStation 5 recently. And, like, I want to play it. But, like, and so, like, you know, we kind of do this. Like, well, we'll recommend each other games. And, like, my youngest is playing Horizon Zero Dawn now. Okay. Yeah, he's liking that.

[00:43:57] But they still also have, like, their own tastes. Like, my oldest, like, I feel, he's 16. And I feel like, I don't know how many times he's played it, replayed it, but he literally, I feel like, lives in the Red Dead universe. Like, he plays Red Dead Redemption all the time. And I'm like, I'll sit there and I'll watch him play. I'm like, don't you get bored of this? And he's like, no. So, I mean, I mean, kudos to the developers, you know, for creating a game that keeps him that. And I don't have to spend as much money buying him games.

[00:44:26] I mean, he's happy with that one, you know? But, yeah. Well, it works. But, yeah. So, like, you know, we have a little bit of back and forth where there's games that we'll try or shows that we'll recommend each other and we'll sit and watch together. And that's great. I love that. But, like, in terms of, like, the comics, like, they used to, and this is what's funny, is they used to think it was pretty cool. But now it's just, like, that's dad stuff. Like, that's, like, they're not as impressed anymore. Like, I used to be able to show them comics. They're like, look at this. And they're like, oh, that's so great.

[00:44:55] And they're like, oh, okay. Yeah. Like, nobody humbles you like your kids. I will say that. A hundred percent. Like, that is absolutely true. No, that's, yeah. No. I mean, that is true. And so, I mean, I guess, are there things that you're, I guess, working on next that you can't really, like, say yet? Do you have your next thing, you know? Yeah. I have a couple. It's so funny.

[00:45:25] Like, as a freelancer, you know, the thing I always worry about and I stress about is, like, you know, is this going to be the last thing I work on? You know, like, I don't have anything lined up. I stress about it all the time. Invariably, I end up working something out and I find something, you know, and, like, I don't do as many conventions as I used to, but I always try to do, like, New York Comic Con because that's the one where I connect with the most editors and writers and stuff.

[00:45:54] And that plots out my next year or two years, you know? So, yeah, I've got, like, three projects coming up. And, like, that's the most I've had in the works in a long time. I'm sorry, four. Sorry, not to brag. But, like... Go ahead. You can... Look, you're the guest. You can brag. It's okay. Well, yeah. So, like, I mean, I have student government coming out in March in my next book, which is also with Mad Cave. But so, student government is through Maverick, which is their young adult imprint. Yeah.

[00:46:23] But my next book will be with Mad Cave, with a Mad Cave proper. And completely, again, totally different. That's what I love about these projects that I do is, like, every one of them are completely different. So, student government is, you know, young adult. It's a little bit more broad appeal. And it's got humor. It's got good heart. The next book I'm doing, which I don't know when they're going to announce,

[00:46:48] is literally a mashup of horror and romance. And it's very violent, very gory. But it's got some really, like, kind of, you know, what I feel is, like, classic old school comics romance stuff in it, too. So, I'm super excited about it. Because, again, like, that's my thing for taking on a new project. It's like, have I done something like this before? And if the answer is no,

[00:47:16] then that automatically shoots the me wanting to do the project, like, up, like, you know, immensely. Because I don't want to keep doing the same thing. And that's what's so exciting about every project that I have coming up, is that they're all different. And, you know, because nobody wants to be typecast, you know? Right. Yeah. Well, that's awesome, Joe. Well, I really appreciate you coming on the podcast today. And, listeners, March 11th, student government.

[00:47:47] I just, I love what Mad Cave and Maverick are doing. And, listeners, if you haven't, find Engine Ward, check it out. Please do. And even Morning Glories, if you're not familiar with, you know, Joe's earlier work. But Morning Glories is great as well. I think that was Image, right? Yeah, it was Image. Yeah, Image Conference. We got 10 trades out for that. Yeah, so I'll put links to stuff in the show notes.

[00:48:16] But, Joe, I just, I'm a huge fan of your work. I can't wait for student government. I can't wait to see what else you have coming out. And I'm just very appreciative of you, you know, chatting with me on the podcast. This has been very nice. Thank you. All right. I'm so happy to have been here. Thank you so much for bringing me on, Jimmy. It's been great. All right, listeners, find me on Blue Sky or Twitter.

[00:48:41] You know, our comic book Yeti, the Cryptid Creator Corner website. Let me know what it is you're reading. Especially if you check out Engine Ward. Let's talk about it. I'm not, I never tire of talking about it. Especially Joe's artwork. It's absolutely amazing. And pick up, you know, student government. They say the Maverick books are like YA, but like I have enjoyed every one of them.

[00:49:05] So I don't let that, you know, don't let that turn you away from what I'm sure will be a very good story and will have fantastic art in it. We have some jokes in student government that I was really surprised they let us get away with for a YA book too. It's not all squeaky clean. Oh, good. Good. Good. And if you need a movie to watch, you know, go check out One Crazy Summer, Better All Dead if you have not seen either of them yet.

[00:49:34] They are very much a product of their time, but very, very, very well worth it, I think. Oh, yes. 100%. All right. Thank you very much for listening. Thank you to Joe for coming on the podcast. And I will see you next time. This is Byron O'Neill, one of your hosts of the Cryptid Creator Corner, brought to you by Comic Book Yeti. We hope you've enjoyed this episode of our podcast. Please rate, review, subscribe, all that good stuff.

[00:50:01] It lets us know how we're doing and more importantly, how we can improve. Thanks for listening. If you enjoyed this episode of the Cryptid Creator Corner, maybe you would enjoy our sister podcast, Into the Comics Kate. Listen and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.