Olivia Cuartero Briggs Interview - Kill Train

[00:00:00] Your ears do not deceive you. You've just entered the Cryptid Creator Corner brought to you by your friends at Comic Book Yeti. So without further ado, let's get on to the interview. Hey everyone, this is- Hi Byron. Who is this? I'm your fairy godmother. I have a fairy godmother? Of course you do. I'm 50 years old, why haven't you shown up before? I appear when I'm needed. And I didn't need you in all these years? Do you want my help or not?

[00:00:28] Um, sure. Exactly. I was just about to pitch our Patreon. Why would I need help with that? Because you're an idiot sometimes. That's hurtful. What were you going to put on there? We do comic stuff? So something along those lines? And this is why I'm here. You do know what people put on Patreon most of the time, right? Honestly, no.

[00:00:54] People need something a little bit spicy to entice them to support you. Nobody wants to see me shirtless. I doubt that's true. You are in pretty good shape considering your age. Thank you. Let's see. A little spicy. I've been bugging Jimmy to figure out what he's going to do. I know lately he's been playing around with his **** all the time. He loves to take it out and show it off. There's even a specific TikTok channel now. How's that sound?

[00:01:21] Not a bad start. People like Jimmy. What else you got? I told a story recently about being in a strip club with some of the four horsemen when I was working for WCW back in the day. I picked up an infection on my- Woo! From the experience, I hate strip clubs. Is that better? Getting there. But maybe spicy shouldn't include infections you get in strip clubs. That's not sexy. We'll workshop it. Like I need more meating.

[00:01:47] At least tell them where to find it while we figure this out. Mother goddess, help this poor man. You can find us on Patreon at Cryptid Creator Corner Pod. I'll put it in the show notes. Anything else you'd like to remind me that I'm bad at? How much time do you have? Why do you look like Rosario Dawson anyway? I appear the way you want me to look. Okay, that's disturbing. Wait, have you been showing up in my dreams? I'll never tell. And we're done here.

[00:02:16] Y'all, Jimmy the Chaos Goblin strikes again. I should have known better than to mention I was working on my DC Universe meets Ravenloft hybrid D&D campaign on social media. My bad. He goes and tags a bunch of comics creators we know, and now I have to get it in gear and whip this campaign into shape so we can start playing. Another friend chimes in, are you going to make maps? It's fair to say it's been a while since I put something together, so I guess, question mark? It was then that I discovered Arkhamforge.

[00:02:45] If you don't know who Arkhamforge is, they have everything you need to make your TTRPG more fun and immersive. Allowing you to build, play, and export animated maps, including in-person Fog of War capability that lets your players interact with maps as the adventure unfolds while you, the DM, get the full picture. Now I'm set to easily build high-res animated maps, saving myself precious time and significantly adding nuance to our campaign. That's a win every day in my book.

[00:03:14] Check them out at arkhamforge.com and use the discount code YETI5 to get $5 off. I'll drop a link in the show notes for you. And big thanks to Arkhamforge for partnering with our show. I think I'm going to make Jimmy play a goblin warlock just to get even. Hello, and welcome to Comic Book Yeti's Cryptid Creator Corner. I'm one of your hosts, Jimmy Gasparo.

[00:03:34] And I'm very excited as we wrap up 2024 and we head into these new episodes for 2025 to be talking with another Mad Cave creator who has written, along with the rest of the creative team, created a first issue that I should have known what to expect from the title. But I still found it surprising.

[00:03:59] It was dark and I can't wait to see where it goes from here. But this is Kiltrain and we're with Olivia Cortero Briggs. Olivia, how are you doing today? I'm doing well. I'm excited for the holidays, but more than anything, I'm just really, really excited to share this book with people come the end of January.

[00:04:27] Working with Mad Cave has been amazing, first of all, and we can talk all about them since you're familiar. But this particular book is simultaneously the most grotesque thing I've ever written and the most personal, which is a weird combination. But yeah, I'm really, really excited to see what it does out there and what reactions people have to it. So thank you for reading the first issue.

[00:04:54] Well, no, thank you for coming on the podcast. And as always, thanks to Mad Cave for setting this up and sending me the first issue. I mean, you know, Kiltrain, it seems like it's all right there in the title. But this is not just a simple everybody gets eviscerated type of situation, although that might happen from the opening pages and the preview pages.

[00:05:18] What I found most surprising is you have a lot of things. But you don't yet explain what exactly that means in the grand scheme of things. And then you just it then it just transitions into the main character, Vanessa, just kind of waking up, going about her day.

[00:05:43] And we learn all about Vanessa with some bits and pieces about this world being fleshed down as it as it goes along. But what what I found so surprising was I was so drawn into what was happening in Vanessa's like day as she goes about it and kind of feeling for her that I forgot as we get to the end of the first issue without spoiling anything. But I kind of forgot that, like, oh, shit, this is Kiltrain.

[00:06:14] Like, but right. If Vanessa's having a bad day now, I was very concerned it was going to get worse for her. But I just found it fascinating how much time was spent with Vanessa and really like building what her world was and what she was dealing with. And I to hear you say that it was one of the most, I guess, gruesome things.

[00:06:42] I'm not sure if that was the word you use, but or grotesque things you had written, but also deeply personal, like kind of made sense to me. It really feels like like I think at one point Vanessa says to another character in the book that she's under it. And then the character asked her, like, what does that mean?

[00:06:57] And it feels like the person who wrote this was also under it, maybe not at the time, but had at least experienced emotionally some of the things Vanessa was kind of going through in this snapshot of her day. Is that the case? That's extremely accurate.

[00:07:18] Well, I mean, it was really interesting what ended up happening with this book because the premise, the idea that, you know, in the not so distant future, New York City experiences this population explosion. And so they institute this kill train program, which is supposed to be, you know, it's randomized extermination, which is supposed to be fair and humane. That idea came to me in a dream. I had this dream that I was watching New York One News, which dates me because New York One News doesn't exist anymore.

[00:07:48] New York used to have its own local news, but I guess it's just world news now. But yeah, so then, you know, I'm watching this on the news and, oh, the kill train program. And it was something that I knew existed. And then sure enough, I end up on a kill train and it's just skipping stops, skipping stops. And all of the passengers and myself are just looking at each other like, oh, my God, we're going to die. And that's when I woke up.

[00:08:14] And I could not I could not stop thinking about this nightmare that I had. And it was right when I had just met all the folks at Mad Cave because Mike Martz had just moved over there from Aftershock. He's not old enough to be my dad. It's not a fair thing to say, but I always call him my dad in comics because he was the first person to publish me. And so, of course, if he's moving companies, I'm going to follow him. Right. Like it's these. I love that man.

[00:08:40] And so I started to get to know a lot of the folks over at Mad Cave. And I pitched them this idea very, very early on. And they were like, we love that. We'd love to see an outline. So I always have like 10,000 projects going on at any given time because I work in comics, but I also work in film and television. And I have just recently gotten my first book deal in the traditional publishing space. So I always have a bunch of things going on.

[00:09:02] And so when it came time, however, to actually write this outline and to break what the story was going to be, I was I was having a really, really hard time. And it was a really dark period in my life. When it shouldn't it shouldn't have been. It felt like it shouldn't have been. I had gotten out of a marriage that was not working and I was falling in love again. And everything should have been great.

[00:09:28] But I guess as anyone who's been through that experience, it awakens a lot of demons. And I was just dealing with a lot and I was exhausted. I was not sleeping well. And I I just found that I was I was furious. I was furious about what was happening in my career. I was furious about what was happening in my personal life. I was I was furious about everything and sad and just just wanting to get this out.

[00:09:57] And I thought, OK, I have to write this outline. I don't know who the main character is and I don't know what the crux of the story is. I could just concoct something or I can use everything that I am feeling to propel this. And maybe Mad Cave will hate it. Maybe they'll say this is ridiculous. What is this? Or maybe they'll love it. And I should also say that I had recently seen Everything Everywhere All at Once, which I gave me major writer envy. And I was like, this is incredible.

[00:10:25] And I want to do I want to do something that's this weird, but for as great a reason. Because the I don't know for any of you who have seen if you haven't seen the movie, my God, it's like a 10 minute catharsis. It's brilliant. Yeah, I love it. Yeah, it was really incredible. So I just decided to go for it. And I took everything that I was dealing with and in ways that are dangerous.

[00:10:53] There are people that could very well read these books and they will recognize things that they have said to me in them. And these are not people that I'm mad at. These are people that I love very dearly, but that said things that hurt me. And I pretended like they didn't. And they caught up with me. And they kind of converged on me all at once.

[00:11:18] But I didn't put these direct quotes and real instances and a lot of the things that have happened to me in my life in the book to finger wag anyone. Like it was my job to digest the things that had happened to me in a constructive way to like sit with how I felt and say like, wow, that hurt my feelings. But like I can take care of myself. I didn't do any of that. It's not up to the world to treat you a certain way. Right?

[00:11:47] People don't mean any harm, but they say offhand the things. It was my job to process these things in a constructive way. And I hadn't done that. So this was my chance to do that and make up for just internalizing a bunch of shit that I didn't need to internalize. And in doing so, I hope that like when people read these books, you're going to you. All right. I know I'm tooting my own horn here, but like I really I really think I nailed this book.

[00:12:14] So you're going to get you're going to get a really awesome action story with like all the great action beats. It's really, really gross and grotesque. And there are like truly psychotic characters. There are huge twists. There are massive emotional moments. I cry wrote nearly all of book four. And at the same time, I really hope that in addition to all of that, what people really get is.

[00:12:44] A deeper understanding of themselves that they you're you're if you've experienced any of these things or felt any of these ways, you're not alone. We have all been there. This is a very female centric story. But that's not to say that men have not felt these ways, that they have been objectified or overlooked or underestimated or just treated like shit. Like we all go through this. You don't need to internalize it. It does not need to affect how you see yourself.

[00:13:12] And it certainly does not affect the way the people that love you most view you. And without spoiling too much, like I hope you all get to realize that before it's too late. I think that's very well said.

[00:13:26] I think there's probably a version of there's probably a version of Kiltrain that is is is more of, you know, maybe a traditional action revenge tale or something, you know, along those lines.

[00:13:43] Um, what really to to, you know, drew me into Vanessa's story and kind of piggyback off of what you were saying that you really experienced is there's all the characters in her life or her her daughter, her fiance, her mother, an old friend of hers. None of them are do anything terrible to her. None of them are malicious. But.

[00:14:12] And especially in terms of what they do say to her and how Mortina Niosi, the artist, kind of drew. Vanessa's. Oh, my gosh. So and so incredible. God. When I was getting these, not just the inks, the pencils, I was like, this this is another color. Like, I haven't been at this level before. It's insane.

[00:14:35] She has a like the way she has done the facial acting for Vanessa as she receives and responds to some of these things. Um, it is almost like. Uh, you know, death by a thousand little cuts that she goes throughout her day. And, um. Yeah. And what it all builds to in this first issue. It's a very well constructed issue. And, um, about Martina Niosi's artwork.

[00:15:05] And I believe it's, uh, I don't know if they're for nice names or pronounce. Simone D'Angelo. Um, the coloring work on it. It's, it's just, it, it was really like heartbreaking and then terrifying in a way that surprised me. Um, yeah, I just was so drawn in to these little snippets of what Vanessa was going through. And. I'm so glad to hear that. You have no idea how happy that makes me because I was concerned about that.

[00:15:35] Um, for a couple reasons. The way, and you mentioned this before. So the way that this is structured. It's, I mean, you didn't mention this specifically, but you were talking about the fact that we open with this kind of like. You're just thrown into the action of the last, the last kill train. Um, and you kind of get the end of that and, and start to understand what the kill train is about. And I put that scene up front because I knew that I had so, I had to, I really had to set up this character well. Um, she had to be multidimensional.

[00:16:04] She had to be real. Otherwise the payoff of this book wasn't going to work. But in comic books, of course, you only have like maximum 24 pages for that first issue to get people hooked. Sure. So I had to put in that action scene up top to, to hook people. What the hell is this? Oh my God, this is horrible. You gotta be kidding me. And before we got into her life and it ended, I'm really glad that I had the foresight to do that. And, and because I think that it really did add to the story and it, it launched it.

[00:16:33] But I was still concerned that we have so much character development in the first issue, uh, before we get to the kill train of it all. That comic book, you know, real deal comic book readers might be like, what is this? Um, and that might be me underestimating readers because comic book readers have gotten so much more savvy.

[00:16:57] And it's so good to hear that you were drawn into that because I always, one of the big pressures that I feel as a comic book creator is like action, action, action. But sometimes you really need character, character, character. Um, so I'm, I'm so glad that you were drawn in, uh, by her drama and you're absolutely right. And I'm so glad you said that it's, there's no one thing that anyone says to her that's awful. Right. It's just people being people. And that was really important to me because I kind of, this is a pet peeve of mine.

[00:17:26] I kind of can't stand it when you're watching these shows. Like for instance, you know, you have this like teenager in school and like a bunch of mean girls walk up to her and they're like, ew, your outfits are disgusting. And I'm just like that. No one says that. No one actually, no one has like, that takes like brass cojones to like walk up to someone and just say something awful because we, none of us think of ourselves as bad people. We don't. Like you, you have to think of yourself as a bad person if you're just going to go up to someone and say something that's like clearly hurtful and disgusting.

[00:17:56] Um, I find that most people, all of these cuts, these hurts, they're inadvertent. They're people either protecting themselves or saying something that reflects something, some part of their own insecurity. They're not trying to hurt you. A lot of times they're trying to help and they just say things that are, that don't, that don't work for you, that make you feel less than, but it's not anything that they are doing on purpose.

[00:18:22] And so I'm really glad that you noticed that, um, because I, I worked really hard to not, I didn't want anyone to be arch. I didn't want anyone to be awful. Um, even, even the assassins on the trains. Oh, really? Oh, I can't wait. I mean, I, I, I, I don't think that any of, well, I mean, they're, they're doing a job, you know, they're, they're doing a job. And, and a lot of them are just, they're deeply disturbed.

[00:18:52] So yeah, there's no, there's no big bads here. I guess, um, in some way the, the city of New York is a big bad, which is kind of hard for me because I'm, that's my home. I'm from New York. You've, you've made them the enemy. I have, I have. And, but I, I did something sneaky and I don't know if you noticed this. I don't know how much you know about, I mean, I think everybody knows that Rudy Giuliani was the mayor of New York. Yes.

[00:19:18] My mayor is Julie Rudani, um, which is, uh, very, very direct. So that was actually my way of making it up to the city. That is my home that I love so much is that it's not actually the city. It's this evil mayor, um, that's doing this. And I think we all know now that, you know, people may have liked him, uh, back in the day. I didn't, I was protesting him, um, nonstop in high school.

[00:19:48] Oh. No. Okay. Oh yeah. He tried to close the Brooklyn Museum because there was an exhibit that he didn't like and he was supporting police officers. There were all of these like horrendous police shootings that were going on. Like this man who was shot like 41 times in a vestibule. It's like he had a candy bar, so he wasn't even armed. Like it was just, it was crazy. Um, and again, I mean, we see so much of that now that we're almost desensitized to it. But yeah, I took every opportunity.

[00:20:16] I marched across the Brooklyn Bridge in high school, like chanting. And yeah, so he's, uh, uh, Rudy Giuliani has been on my shit list for a long time. Okay. Well, it's, uh, so yeah, I'm getting to do a little female version of him. That's the enemy. Um, so yeah, I, I, I pinned it on him because the other thing that I felt kind of bad about is that I always get on people's cases. You know, they, they come to New York, especially like tourists, they come to New York City and like, oh my God, I never ride the subway train. It's so dangerous. And I'm like, oh my God, shut up.

[00:20:46] Get with it. Just take the train. What are you going to spend all this money on a taxi? You know, I really, I give people a really hard time and here I am creating this story. And I don't know if you've looked at my Instagram, but I'm, I've also been making these like little promo videos. Oh, I'll have to check them out. And totally, uh, making people terrified of taking the train. And even now after writing this book, I, when I go home and I go down into the subway, I cannot not think about it. I am like, of course I still take the train, but I've scarred myself.

[00:21:15] Um, so, so yeah, I'm, I love you, New York. I'm so sorry to the MTA and, and all the MTA workers. It was like, blame it on my dream. But yes, I'm pinning it on an evil mayor. Uh, well that, that's fine. Um, yeah, I, I like taking the subway. I was in New York, New York, uh, earlier. I guess I was in New York earlier this month. My wife and I were, we're going to see a show and then go into dinner and I. Oh, nice. What did you see? Uh, we saw swept away.

[00:21:44] Oh, I don't think I've heard of that one. Is it great? I loved it. It's based off of the music of, uh, the Avid brothers. Oh, really? Yeah. And it's, it, uh, they just, but we, um, we, no, we got to see it, I guess last month, November. And then like the, the next week they announced it was closing on December 15th. Like they just opened in November. I think they extended their run.

[00:22:12] Now this is now in a swept away podcast. Uh, I think they extended their run to the end of December, but it's a, I, I'm a big huge Avid brothers fan. The, the musical is based off of, uh, they, they constructed a story using their music about a, um, four survivors of a, of a shipwreck in like, I guess the late 1800s. And, um, yeah, it's not for everybody. It's very dark. Uh, it's a very dark show, but, uh, beautifully done.

[00:22:42] Shout out to John Gallagher Jr. Uh, cause he's from Delaware where I am and, uh, he was wonderful. So. Well. But yeah. That's no, that, that's very cool and very good to hear that they're doing cool, different dark stuff on Broadway because, and this is actually, I'm not bullshitting you at all. You know, I've been talking to my reps a lot and like, you know, people that are curious about the book about like, you know, well, do you see this like becoming like a feature or a television show?

[00:23:10] And I'm like, yeah, it could totally be a feature and we'll probably pitch it as such. But I want to see this as a Broadway musical. Oh my gosh. I do. I want to see Giltrane on Broadway. People might have to have splash guards for the blood, but, um, I don't know why it, I've, I've, I don't think I've ever written a comic book that I've, I could see as a musical, but for whatever reason, this one, I love talking about, I love talking about comic books and musicals.

[00:23:40] Um, like every time a comic book writer mentions, mentions a musical, I, I, I don't know what it is. I love comics. I love comics. I love comics. I love musicals. I know after Sondheim passed, James Tinian was talking about how some of his comic books were influenced by, by Sondheim. I think Tom King with one of his books, he talked about how it was influenced by Into the Woods. And, um. Oh, cool. Uh, yeah. I, you know.

[00:24:08] You never forget the live theater that you see. You really don't. It makes such an impact. No, I, I, I agree. I, Giltrane as a musical. Oh my gosh. That would, I would love to see it. And it's totally doable too. I've even thought about like, you know, you could have like one train car with two sides, you just keep rotating it. So you, for each train car, clean it up, change it on the backside and then you rotate it and it's in play. My dad was a set designer. So of course I'm thinking about the, the production elements.

[00:24:38] And if I had to pick just offhand any musical artist to write the music for me, I think it would be LP. If you're familiar, if you're not, you should, you should find that on Spotify. LP. She's amazing. Amazing. No, no. I'm not familiar. I will. LP. If you're out there. I will check that out. Find me. That would be something. That, that would be something.

[00:25:03] I mean, I just, I just, that would be, I mean, to have a, you know, a splash. I actually saw, I directed a musical in Delaware that had a splatter zone. We did, we did evil. We did evil dead. The musical in, in, in Delaware back in 2009. That's amazing. And we had a splatter zone. So I, I've seen it done. It can be done. So.

[00:25:31] When, you know, with, with all the different work that you've done, you, cause you mentioned you worked in film and television and you've written plays, you know, and comic books. Do you, as a, as a writer, do you have any preference or are you just looking to see how can I tell this story and what medium is the best way to get it across? Yeah. Um, it really is about the best medium for the idea. And there are certain ideas that I have that don't leave me alone.

[00:26:00] Um, but not every medium is right for every idea. So not every idea is supposed to be a comic book. Not every idea is supposed to be a film. Um, thankfully there are a lot of ideas that can translate from, from one to the other. Again, like I, I feel like Kiltrain, the, the way that it's structured and, you know, we can talk again once you've gotten to read all the issues. Um, it could very easily be a feature. I've actually, uh, I've been, I'm waiting until the new year to corner, um, Mike and James,

[00:26:29] uh, my editor about this, but I would really love to do another volume of Kiltrain. Um, because I feel like I thought Vanessa's story was over and now I'm realizing, oh my gosh, no, it's not. And, uh, there's, there's a whole other story to be told. I'm sorry if you're picking up that noise. That's my rabbit Bob who is rebelling against the second story of his cage. He's knocking it out again, which is what he likes to do. Well, it's all right. Listeners, that's rabbit Bob and we'll, we'll, we'll forgive him. I'm lucky that I don't hear my, my dog upstairs.

[00:26:57] We got a puppy not that long ago and he is a lot of noise as well. So yeah, he's whatever. Thank you. For whatever reason, he's being very quiet right now. Uh, which is nice. But, um, but, but yeah, in terms of genre and ideas, what I'm finding these days is that, um, I'm gravitating a lot towards comic books and the traditional publishing space and novels,

[00:27:22] um, uh, as a way to debut ideas because it's, it's tangible and it lasts and it's something that's out there. It's, um, I've, I've, I mean, I've written many, you know, screenplays and many TV pilots and many plays that no one will ever see ever, ever. Not even after I die. There's no one who's like publishing screenplays. It's like, Hey, isn't this cool?

[00:27:51] No, like it used to be made into a movie. Um, and that is very expensive, but I can write comic books and they can get published. And, you know, even if they're not like massive hits, when they first come out, they're discoverable. They're out there. I can write a novel. And again, you know, the, the, the same thing. It's, it's out there as something in the world that people can consume that is finished, that that's lasting.

[00:28:17] And maybe it's just cause I'm getting older, but I'm starting to think about what this legacy is that I'm creating, that I'm leaving the, the, the stories that need to be told. And, you know, in the entertainment industry too, in film and television, it is always easier to sell something that exists in some other format first. So be it a graphic novel, be it a novel, even documentaries. Um, it's just easier to get them across the finish line.

[00:28:42] Um, and again, it's not for every project, but more and more I'm, I'm finding that I want to commit these stories to the page in some sort of permanent lasting way. So I can give these stories to the world. And then again, this is like long gaming it. But you know, then if, you know, there's, there's interest and people want to see this in another format, pursuing it that way afterwards.

[00:29:07] But, um, the goal is always, always, always just to write the best comic book I possibly can, or the best book that I possibly can, whatever medium it is that I'm working in, to create the best of that thing. I never write a comic book so that I can make a TV show of it or a movie of it. It's, it's disingenuous to the medium and it's, uh, it's not, it's not respectful of the fans.

[00:29:31] And the one thing that I have really come to appreciate about the comic book space are the fans and the readers. There is no other community like the comic book community. It, it's incredible. And I just, I feel very lucky at how warmly I've been welcomed and the fact that, you know, publishers keep me, keep me working. Um, and I hope they continue to do so into, into 2025.

[00:30:00] I actually, I think I have three books coming out next year. Oh, um, yeah. And the folks over at DC, last time I rang their bell, I think I had like, I just had two books out. I had had, uh, Mary Shelley, Monster Hunter and Silver City. And they were like, well, you need a few more books. So I'm thinking that now that I've had, I had John the Killers this year and, uh, Fate the Wink Saga in 2025. I have Kiltrain coming out. I have, uh, the second volume of, uh, Fate the Wink Saga.

[00:30:29] And I have another unannounced project. My first, um, rom-com comic book. Oh, that's... Very different from Kiltrain. Yeah. With Maverick. Um, also coming out next year. I'm hoping after all of that, that Deep is finally like, okay, we'll give her a character. I just, I just want to try it once or twice. That would be great. Um, yeah. I love the stuff. I mean, I, I love the stuff that Maverick is putting out. And, um, like... They're amazing.

[00:30:59] Yeah, the past couple of... No one knows where they came from. Yeah, the past couple of books... It's so cool. They've done... They just, like, exploded out of the water. And I, I'm so proud to be a part of what they're doing. And their editors are incredible. There was so much talent. And they put so much behind their books. It's been, it's been such a breath of fresh air. Um... After some of the experiences that I had.

[00:31:26] Um, but yeah, there, it's been a really, really wonderful home. And, you know, to what we were talking about earlier with Kiltrain. Again, it's, um, it's a non-conventional first issue. Um, and what you were saying, it's, it's a non-conventional way to tell an action story with a struggling single mom at the helm. And they never once, you know, from the time I handed in this outline that I was really like, oh my...

[00:31:50] I, I wrote it, I was, I was jet-lagged out of my mind on the, I was literally, I was on the, um, the Eurostar. Going back and forth from London to Paris. Because I have a few projects in the UK. Um, so I was, like, trying to, like, get work done on a vacation, which was ridiculous. And I don't know why I do this to myself. But I, I literally wrote this entire outline on that Eurostar.

[00:32:18] Um, and turned it in thinking, this, I, this could be the best thing I've ever written or it could be complete gobbledygook. I have no idea. And they were like, this is great. I, I didn't, I didn't have one note. Awesome. They were like, yeah, this is, this is you on the page. And so to have that kind of support for a story like this, um, has been really, really incredible. And, um, James Abbott, my, my editor on this book is just, is such a doll.

[00:32:45] And it, I think sometimes I take for granted how incredible it is to have an editor that you are so comfortable with. That you, you know, share personal details about your lives. And, you know, we're always, we're always really happy to see each other at conventions. And just, just having that comfort level to put yourself out on the page and to never hear something stupid. Like, oh, well, people might flinch at that or like, oh, well this, you know, this isn't actiony enough. No, it was all like, okay, Olivia. Yeah.

[00:33:15] Like bleed all over the page and like, oh, here's some guts too. Okay, great. You know, it was just, it was, it's been really tremendous. And I'm just, I'm so grateful that they welcomed me into their flock. So, so early on. I mean, like literally I just walked up to them and they were like, oh, like, you know, Mike, he's our new dude. Okay. Come on. We got stuff for you. So it's been, it's been pretty amazing. That's awesome. Yeah.

[00:33:42] And I, I just, I, I really love the first issue. I mean, I just think I cannot wait to see where it goes. And your collaborators that, you know, you're working with on the book are incredible. James, his name has come up countless times. I feel like on this podcast. Oh God, he deserves that. I, I, I, I say nice things about him, despite the fact that he's very tall and I usually, not a fan of tall people.

[00:34:10] It's my only, it's my only hang up as somebody who's five, six, but despite being very tall, he's very nice as well. And a very good editor. Hey, it's, I, I, I am. And you might not like me either. I'm glad we're, we're meeting, sitting down over a podcast because I also have a few inches on you, sir. And I'm wearing high heeled boots right now. So that's fine. You're very lovely. You're very nice. And I really like your writing.

[00:34:38] So thank you so much. Yeah. Um, one of the things you said I wanted to ask about, you know, um, cause I think it makes a lot of sense. Uh, you know, when I think about writing that so many times when you're, you're trying to get, you know, when you're writing a screenplay or trying to get like staffed in a writer's

[00:35:02] room and like, you know, writing a, a spec script or I don't even know if anyone does that anymore, but, um. No, you have to. Everyone's writing spec. You mean specs of existing shows? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's. Yeah, that's done less and less. But yeah, spec just means you're writing it for free. Oh yeah. No, I, but like. We all work for free over here. Of the existing shows. But like when you're trying to get something made, it seems like, you know, so many times

[00:35:28] I, when I've, I've heard from like people like working in the industry, like you can spend countless hours doing things and then nothing comes of it. As so many times, even with television shows and movies, you can get so close and then not, you know, have a thing made. The one thing in terms of comics though, I mean, even though it can cost money if you're going to self publish something, there is a higher likelihood that, you know, you're going to see it and get to see the thing in print.

[00:35:57] But, um, but in terms of the other side, you know, not just wanting to, to be able to see the thing that you've made, but like, how have you ever had, have, have you ever had to deal with getting close and how have you dealt with that? Like, is that something you rebound from easily or do you, do you wear all those scars from those close calls? I mean, reading Vanessa, I think I know the answer, but.

[00:36:26] Well, it's, it's, it's an interesting question. Um, I, I always love it when people tell these stories of like, you know, Rocky got like, you know, when Sylvester Stallone was taking that scripture on, everyone rejected it. He got like 18 rejections before somebody actually made it. And they say the same thing about like J.K. Rowling and Harry Potter, you know, like she took it to like 20 different editors and everyone said, no, like, can you believe it? And I'm like, yes, because that is literally the story of everything.

[00:36:55] Everything that has ever been made has gotten a million nos and one yes. Yeah. That's all you need is one yes. So have I gotten close to getting things made and not? Yes. Oh my God. I have had, I mean, I've, I've gotten to the point where like I had, um, you know, the celebrity attachments to my project studio attachments. I had whole deals in place for like when we sold it and I was going to make like 125 K just for like writing this pilot.

[00:37:23] Like I've had, I've had all of those deals in place. And then the pandemic happened. Then we came out of the pandemic and then there was a strike. So, yeah, I mean, it's, it's, you get knocked down over and over and over again. It's just, but it's, it's part of the business. I cannot say that like, you know, it's, it's been a rough couple of years for all of us

[00:37:50] in the entertainment business because, you know, the, the business, the, the whole business, the whole town shut down about seven months before the strike, unless you were a big name. Like if you're Shonda Rhimes, you're fine. But for the rest of us, like mid to even upper level, like you couldn't, you couldn't get anything sold, certainly nothing that was like new or different or, or weird. Um, it really, really had to be established.

[00:38:16] Um, and it's been hard and it sometimes, you know, we all ask ourselves like, what the hell are we doing here? Like I'm, I'm living in LA paying crazy prices to survive, um, bankrupting myself so that I can work for free for people that don't always seem to appreciate it. It's, it can be really, really tough, but then you kind of sit back and you look around,

[00:38:46] or at least I do. And I realized everything that I do have, I have an incredible team that I have, I have, I've earned. Um, I have amazing friends. I'm developing projects with like serious legendary screenwriters, like, and, and they love my work. I have so much support.

[00:39:12] But if you have, man, if you've entered this business because you thought you were going to make a ton of money, like, I don't know what to tell you. There's no, there, there's no sure shot. So yeah, yeah. There's certainly times where like, I have felt demoralized and why can't I just sell this? And oh my God, not only that, but like, like friends of mine, I've had incredible things happen.

[00:39:38] Friends, friends that like made it kind of sound like they were going to staff me on their huge projects. And then it fell through and you're like, oh my God, I can't even get staffed on my friend show. And you know, but there's so, there's so many factors. There's so many factors. It's just about, I guess at the end of the day, like really asking yourself, like, do I belong here? And do I, do I have, have I honed my craft enough to earn my spot here? And can I do anything else?

[00:40:09] And for me, the answer is yeah, I put in my 10,000 hours and I'm, I'm really good at what I do. Have I been the luckiest person? No, but I have not been the most unlucky at all. I've got, I mean, the fact that I have been able to put out these books over the past few years and that I have so many coming down the line, there's another project with humanoids that should be coming out all week 2026. Fantastic publisher. Yeah, they really are really amazing.

[00:40:38] And they've been doing incredible work as a company too, just like really trying to figure out like who they are, what they're doing, how to sell books, because the whole model has changed. I mean, the fact that I have all of these relationships, you have to keep going. I have to keep going. I have to keep going no matter what, because then the answer to the second question I ask, can I do anything else? No, I can't. Can't do anything else. So I have to make this work or die trying.

[00:41:06] And if I lose my compass, that's when I read Kiltrain again. Yeah. Because really the whole story's there. And that's the other wonderful process about creating this book is writing it was incredibly fulfilling, writing the scripts, but that doesn't mean that I still don't have hard times than I have. And it's been hard to be a member of this industry lately. These things are not moving. And I have all of these amazing ideas and things that I want to put out in the world.

[00:41:35] And everything is just wait, wait, wait. And then I, you know, so I'm kind of going through another like shitty patch. And then I'm getting the inks back and the colors back. And the story is telling itself to me again. And it's saying what the book says. Just like, don't give up. You're so much more powerful than you know. And I'm so grateful that I've been able to go on this ride and that I get to keep going

[00:42:04] on this ride and talking to folks like you about it. And then I'll get to go on the ride again and people start reading it. Oh, my God. I'm so scared and excited. But yeah, it's, it's, I hope that it empowers people. And I hope that it scares the shit out of people and grosses people out all at the same time. Because that's what it's done for me. Yeah. Me too. Me too. That's exactly, that's exactly how I felt. Oh, it's going to get way more gross. Yeah.

[00:42:34] I mean, again, not to give anything away, but where the, I thought it was bad where the issue one began. It is, it is, it is worse where it ends. And I was like, shouldn't have read this right after dinner. Yeah, no. That was a mistake, listeners. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Just wait. Just wait. I, I, I can't, man.

[00:43:01] I have the best artists and the way, Bob, seriously, let me just say that the way that they deal with guts, masterful. There are masterful guts coming in future issues. Now, yeah, that's, there's a pull quote, masterful guts. Yeah. Coming your way. Do you like shining, shimmering guts? Really, really, really well done.

[00:43:27] Um, well, I know I, it was reading a little bit about you before, you know, before the interview. Um, and it seemed, I mean, I don't think you started out to get into, to comics. Um, was when you first started writing, and I know it's been a number of years now that you've been writing comics. Um, did you find it a difficult transition from other forms of writing, from like writing

[00:43:58] screenplays or writing plays to, to writing comics? Um, difficult, no. But I did find it very exciting. Because in comics, and this isn't always true, I feel like, um, probably Kill Train, there are probably some areas in which, like, if it were a feature, I, I would have a little bit more space. But, but, but with Kill Train aside, for the most part, stories in comic books move faster

[00:44:26] than stories in television or film, or certainly in, in books. Um, and so there's something very compelling about that. And in TV writing specifically, um, especially like when you're working on a show, um, you really, everything needs to be very, very driven. Um, and because you're, you're, you're trying to keep audiences engaged. Like, particularly like when you work on a show like Queen of the South, like that's all about like action and audience engagement and, um, and, and keeping people hooked and on the edge of their seat.

[00:44:57] And, um, the same thing is true for, for comics. And so that was the, the TV work that I had done was incredible training. Um, the other thing that's really similar with TV writing and comic book writing is you have act outs in television. And with these comic book arcs, you have like book outs, right? You have like the end of an issue and it very much feels like an act out. You want that big turning point right at the end of an issue to get people to come back the following month. That's huge. A month. Oh yeah. It's a long time.

[00:45:27] Like you re that's got, it's gotta be even bigger than, you know, than an act out in, uh, in television. So what was so exciting about moving to comics was that it was kind of everything that I had learned in TV, but amped. The other thing that was amazing, amazing about going to comics is that I did not have to think about budget. Yeah. I can do whatever I want. No, really. But that's so true. Yeah. Very true. But you know, in, in film and television, like you can't, I know a lot of people do

[00:45:56] it more power to you. If you're this kind of writer and you get lucky and you're, you know, 20 million, $50 million action film gets made. I, I would never dare write something like that because it's just, it is so, there's so few places that can produce that. Right. You really, you want to write something that someone can say, okay, like, can we make this for five to 10 million? Like that's, that's a nice sweet spot. Right.

[00:46:23] Um, but in comic books, of course you don't have to think about that. I mean, what, whatever someone can draw, you can put on the page. And so to liberate your, your mind like that, literally anything that I can think of, it has been such a gift as a writer and it has allowed me to stretch my brain in so many different ways. Also in comics, there's a real focus and it's interesting. I don't know if all these publishers know that they do this, but I, whenever I get a chance,

[00:46:53] I always like to meet with an editor in chief and just hear about like, what, what's your brand? What do you want to see? What are the kinds of stories that you want to tell? Well, I always like to know what people are excited by that way. When I have an idea, I, I know kind of where to go with it. Um, and so many of them say, I want your weird, give me your weird. And that is not something that you hear in film and television because so much money goes into it. They want to make sure that they can appeal to a fairly wide swath of people.

[00:47:23] TV, of course, it was more niche. It's the industry kind of died. It's rebuilding itself. I don't know what it's going to look like when it comes back. Um, but the idea that, you know, in comics, they want you to get as weird as you can. And I, I have pitched some weird stuff that people have gotten very excited about.

[00:47:45] Um, and I was shocked and it's, it is so cool to be able to crack your mind open in this way. And it's something I've always wanted to do as a writer because, you know, when you come from stage, you tend, at least for me, I, as a contemporary playwright, um, it was very much like, you know, a few people in a room and you don't want to have too many set changes again, like this produceability, very grounded, real, those like dramatic elements. That was the world that I came from.

[00:48:12] And it took me a bit to start thinking like not only high concept, but like high concept, that fucking weird. And that, that was such a gift. I never would have found it without comic books. And once you, once you as a creator start opening your mind to the weird, you'd be amazed at how many ideas to start pouring in. So it's, it's been a tremendous gift. I am so glad that I found it.

[00:48:41] I, I wish, I wish that it like paid a living wage, but I don't care. I don't care. I'm getting, I wish I could make real money at it. You, you would. That's where the options come in. But, um. Yeah. Maybe somewhere down the road, but I'm, I don't think I'll ever stop doing it because it is, it is the most liberating place for a creator to be is, is in the world of comics. I would venture to say even more so than the traditional publishing space.

[00:49:09] Well, I, um, I'm glad you're here. Uh, I thought Kiltrain was phenomenal. Kiltrain's one of the, the type of issue that I want to go check out the other things that you've done. Uh, Jill and the, is it Jill and the Killers? Killers, yeah. And, um. I do a lot of killing. Silver City? Yep. And Mary Shelley, Monster Hunter was my first book with Adam Glass. Yeah.

[00:49:33] Um, I, I just thought it was a really exciting first issue and I really, I can't wait to see where it goes. Um, so listeners, January 22nd, it should be out. Make sure you tell your local comic shop that you want it to make sure you get a copy of it. I will say that, um, I don't know. I, I, I don't know if there's variant covers, but the cover art that I saw for it was Skylar Patrick, who I just think the world of, uh. I know.

[00:50:03] Isn't she amazing? Fantastic cover. Yeah. Yeah. Um, uh, absolutely. So, she did a bunch of, uh, a bunch of my covers for Jill and the Killers too. And yeah, she is an incredible, incredible talent. Very lucky to have her on these. There's also, um, I think it's the issue three cover is, uh, is an homage to The Shining, but with the subway doors. It's so good. Yeah. It's really, really, really great cover art coming with these books.

[00:50:32] Uh, well, I, I wish you and the rest of the team and Mad Cave, uh, a lot of success with the story. Um, I, I've, you know, before we started recording, I said that we just recently passed our, like, our 300th episode and at least a hundred and, I don't know, 60 some of them are mine. Um, so I've talked to, you know, my fair share of comic book creators over the past three or four years.

[00:50:56] I, I, I can't think of a time though, after doing one of these interviews where I was excited to write something. The, just listening to you talk about comics and talk about, you know, make it as weird as you can and, and, and, and push yourself to do those things.

[00:51:19] Um, I, it, this was just such a treat for me to be able to talk to you about Kiltrain and about your kind of journey in writing and in comic books. And, um, yeah, this was, uh, I'm, this was phenomenal for me. And I just think you really crushed it with this, this issue of Kiltrain. I can't wait to see the rest of the series. Oh, thank you. I'm glad to inspire. Send me whatever you write.

[00:51:48] I want to see it. I want to read it. I, I will. I'll, I'll do that. One of these days. Yes, get to it. It's important. I, I agree. It is important. That's why I first started doing this and first started like writing a little bit myself, just so I would have, you know, something out there in the world. Uh, so what you said, I, I, I really connected to, but, um, and who knows? Uh, uh, maybe one day I'll, I'll, I'll be coming to New York to see Kiltrain the musical.

[00:52:19] Yeah. Oh, wouldn't we all be so lucky? Um, so listeners, uh, uh, January 22nd, Kiltrain from Mad Cave. Um, please go out and get it. Uh, let me know once you do, if you've read it, what you think, I think you're really going to love it. It is gross, but it is, there is a, there is a heart to this thing, um, that we don't see a lot.

[00:52:47] This, this story in other hands would be told in, in a different way that I think would be less than what Olivia and the team has done here has created a protagonist that feels like somebody you bumped into and then didn't apologize to on the street. And now she's going to be on this train that I, I, there's just something about it. So, um, yeah, uh, a lip for comic book Yeti. I've been Jimmy

[00:53:15] Gasparo, my guest, Olivia, uh, Cortero Briggs. Um, thank you very much. Thank you for listening and I'll see you next time. Good night. This is Byron O'Neill. One of your hosts of the cryptic creator corner brought to you by comic book Yeti. We hope you've enjoyed this episode of our podcast. Please rate, review, subscribe, all that good stuff. It lets us know how we're doing and more importantly, how we can improve. Thanks for listening.

[00:53:44] If you enjoyed this episode of the cryptic creator corner, maybe you would enjoy our sister podcast into the comics cave, listen and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.