Will Dennis talks DSTLRY

[00:00:00] Your ears do not deceive you. You've just entered the Cryptid Creator Corner brought to

[00:00:05] you by your friends at Comic Book Yeti. So without further ado, let's get on to the interview.

[00:00:30] Here is the Jaguar, the Hummingbird and the unicorn to defend the children from an ancient

[00:00:34] evil at Haunster nightmares. I got an advanced look at this and it blew me away.

[00:00:39] Artist Stefano Simeone is top level talent having worked on Mega Man, Radiant Black and Star Wars

[00:00:45] among other things. And this is a perfect fit for a story that has something of a cross between

[00:00:49] so many of the team-oriented 80s cartoons I love.

[00:00:52] I interviewed David a couple years ago for his graphic novel Finding Gossamer and I've been

[00:00:56] looking forward to seeing what he does next. This has a look of something that will definitely

[00:01:00] get picked up by major publishers so get in on the ground floor. Head over to Kickstarter

[00:01:04] and search for Battle Mechs to sign up for notifications when this thing goes live.

[00:01:09] I've also dropped a link in the show notes to make it easy for you. It will be available

[00:01:13] in both English and Spanish which I absolutely love. This podcast has always been about promoting

[00:01:18] diversity, inclusion and comics and it makes it so much more accessible to a wider community

[00:01:23] of new younger readers. Don't miss it.

[00:01:26] This is Byron O'Neal, your host for today's episode of the Cryptic Creator Corner. Today

[00:01:33] I'm joined by someone who if his name doesn't immediately leave to mind, I'd damn near guarantee

[00:01:38] you've read something he's worked on. For over 15 years he has helped shape the voices

[00:01:42] and vision of what is arguably the most recognized comics imprint of all time DCs

[00:01:46] Vertigo. Until he transitioned to working as a freelance editor for Image, Comicsology,

[00:01:51] DC, First Second Books and TKO to name a few. He's worked with the biggest heavy hitters

[00:01:56] in the business for two decades and is now turning his attention to helping launch the new

[00:02:00] Comics Publishing Company Distillery as it's founding editor. Well then thanks for joining

[00:02:05] me on the show today.

[00:02:06] Oh you're welcome. Thanks for that intro.

[00:02:09] Not too bad. I heard it pretty impressive, I know I have to say.

[00:02:13] Good. That's what we're going for. We've gotten into habit of checking to see who the

[00:02:19] editor is on everything I pick up and your name keeps popping up. I'm going back and filling

[00:02:24] in some gaps from back when. Most recently that was Greek Street, which I got to say

[00:02:29] it was excellent.

[00:02:30] Oh, excellent.

[00:02:31] Yeah.

[00:02:32] Whoa. That's a blast from the past. Peter Milligan, the most underrated comic book writer

[00:02:36] of the last 35 years probably.

[00:02:40] Yeah his stuff's great. That was a huge swing. I really, really enjoyed it conceptually.

[00:02:45] I was like why didn't they make a TV series about this, but I guess that was before the

[00:02:50] big IP grab.

[00:02:51] Yeah. And you know, I mean, Vertigo being part of Warner Brothers at the time. Yeah.

[00:02:58] I mean, you could ask that about so much of the stuff. It's like, you know, where are

[00:03:01] the shows for 100 bullets? A lot of other stuff that seems pretty obviously translatable.

[00:03:06] But yeah, those wheels ground pretty slow, particularly in those days. But yeah, that

[00:03:12] wasn't that one a while. I mean, I'd love Peter's work for like years and years and

[00:03:18] years. And then finally had reached out to him to be like, hey, do you want to try to

[00:03:22] do some stuff? And he puts a bunch of things. I didn't think we ended up doing two or

[00:03:26] three things right in a row there. There was a one called the names. And there was another

[00:03:31] one that they ended up finishing. I think it image or something that was kind of towards

[00:03:35] end of my run at Vertigo. But yeah, I breached it was a great one. Yeah. I enjoyed that.

[00:03:42] Cool. Well, yeah, let's jump into the distillery. There's not too much coverage out there

[00:03:47] right now, which is part why I wanted to have you on for a chat. You know, there's some

[00:03:51] comics,ology roots with David Steinberger and Chip Moser kind of having pivotal roles as

[00:03:57] CEO and CCO respectively. And okay, so you'll have to forgive me here. I've been reading

[00:04:02] comics since 1979. And we've both seen a lot of you publishing companies enter and exit

[00:04:08] the scene. So what was missing in the medium that led to the idea that would become distillery?

[00:04:16] I think it's this combination of a lot of stuff. One, it's where we all were at in our careers

[00:04:23] in terms of the work that we've done, the people that we knew, the people we thought we could

[00:04:27] bring on board. There was this sort of combination of somebody who really intimately knows the digital

[00:04:36] space and basically created like the digital reading experience as most people know it, you know,

[00:04:42] in David's work at comics,ology and all that stuff. And then you have, but then you also have

[00:04:49] this push on the other side to create kind of artifacts. Like all the moving sounds,

[00:04:55] that sounds kind of hoki, but you know what I mean? Like comics that like of a higher

[00:04:59] quality bigger size, something different format wise, something that would sort of feed in

[00:05:05] so a lot of the collectible stuff that came has really recent years kind of reinvigorated a lot

[00:05:14] of the industry and for good or bad some of it. Yeah, it was just that sort of thing. And then

[00:05:22] can you get creators of the certain quality? But can you also then give them participation in

[00:05:27] the company and ownership of their IP. And there isn't a lot of that, you know, the monkey business

[00:05:32] and even being in a place like Vertigo. I mean it was tech, you know, it's creator owned as much as

[00:05:37] it could be. And like basically the Vertigo contract is the same contract that all these other

[00:05:43] smaller publishers have, you know, copied over the years, you know, in terms of it being like a shared

[00:05:49] ownership and that sort of thing. And so, um, so it's not quite as creator owned as like an

[00:05:55] image is where they don't take any kind of interest or stake in the IP beyond the publishing

[00:06:03] stuff, you know, obviously but yeah, I was trying to figure out like what's the sweet spot there?

[00:06:09] Like, you know, where you've been you're taking a risk as a publisher so you want a certain amount

[00:06:14] of participation, but you also don't want to be dissuading people because for a long time,

[00:06:18] particularly towards my end, Ron at Vertigo, that was the big,

[00:06:22] that was the hardest thing for us to overcome, right? Like once the image in the early,

[00:06:27] you know, like maybe 2010, 11, 12 started to really pick up steam. And we couldn't really compete

[00:06:33] with that at Vertigo in terms of, you know, well we're doing the same kind of project,

[00:06:38] these cool genre creator owned things but they don't, they don't want any stake here,

[00:06:42] they don't take any stake in the media stuff, you know? Right. So that was in the deal breaker on

[00:06:48] so many things. I mean, I definitely there's a number of projects that ended up the image that,

[00:06:53] you know, were on my desk originally and then, you know, like you just couldn't get it sorted out

[00:06:58] because, you know, why they didn't want to have to share anything with DC or Vertigo,

[00:07:03] which you know was fine if you have an alternative, but you know, I totally support that.

[00:07:10] So yeah, so I think the stillery was to try to figure out like all those moving parts,

[00:07:14] you know, that would sort of something that Collectors and the print industry would like.

[00:07:19] And but also this digital, you know, trying to figure out it's this digital comic reading experience

[00:07:24] and but also like this digital marketplace, you know, and then, right, trying to treat people in a

[00:07:30] certain way, creators fair, you know, in a certain way, if they're like with the equity states

[00:07:36] and all the rest of the that they have. So yeah, I mean, it's like a work in progress obviously,

[00:07:41] but you know, so far, it feels like so far so good. Yeah, I mean, it's a really, I think,

[00:07:46] novel foundational approach that I haven't seen before, which kind of hopefully will

[00:07:50] insulate the company from some of the pitfalls of, you know, navigating the indie comics publishing

[00:07:55] space because you brought down the expertise from all these very entertainment fields, you know,

[00:08:00] you have a movie producer, a video game executive tech strategist, even a mediocre giant with

[00:08:05] Kodansha, you know, like which sort of blew my mind because I saw them on a premier league dash

[00:08:10] or recently. So that's, that's, that's a big deal to have that much reach. So I know you've been

[00:08:17] doing all that that freelance work for Comic Sology. So you've got that established connection.

[00:08:22] Was it in bringing you on board? Was it simple as like, hey, Will, we've got this new thing you want

[00:08:27] to jump in? Yeah, I mean, pretty much. I mean, I think it's like, you know, my philosophy has always

[00:08:34] been like if I hire really good people, then you know, makes my job a lot easier, makes my life

[00:08:40] a lot easier in general, you know. You know, it comes with its own issues at times if you're working

[00:08:46] with people at a certain, you know, part of the food chain or whatever, you know, the approach is

[00:08:50] different, but yeah, if you hire really good people to do their stuff, like I don't need to be

[00:08:55] meddling in the thing and I think David and Chip definitely sort of share the same philosophy.

[00:09:01] It's like they know, I mean, Chip is great at the promotional stuff and dealing with the retailers

[00:09:06] and kind of having his finger on also a lot of that sort of thing. And then David is, you know,

[00:09:11] just say that more of the type, going to answer Pandora, you know, fundraising, understanding how

[00:09:17] they're, you know, raise money and get it from all these different parts and different

[00:09:22] different parts of different industries that, you know, you may end up leaning on or leveraging later

[00:09:27] for stuff. And so, but that kind of leads out the editorial, you know, side. So it's like, all right,

[00:09:33] well then why don't we just go find the person that we really trust who has a track record and

[00:09:39] works with all the people that we kind of admire and a lot of people that we're bringing in.

[00:09:43] So yeah, it seemed like a real obvious fit, you know.

[00:09:47] Yeah. So what does your role look like on kind of a day-to-day basis?

[00:09:50] Yeah, it's a little, it's a little, there were some issues like nice issues but like trying

[00:09:59] to define it because I'm not the editor-in-chief right. So you know, and that was a bit by a choice on

[00:10:04] my part of think, you know? Just meaning that I could still keep like a lot of the other freelance

[00:10:10] stuff that I've been doing. Yeah, keep it, you know, like I'm not exclusive to distillery per se.

[00:10:15] You know, I still have, I don't know, probably a half a dozen or more books at the moment.

[00:10:20] And you know, an image at other places still finishing up stuff at Comic-Sology doing, you know,

[00:10:27] bits and bobs for other smaller companies here and there. Yeah.

[00:10:31] So in that respect, like I'm not really operating as an editor-in-chief,

[00:10:34] like it's more of a consultant role kind of on the bigger picture side and then,

[00:10:40] you know, but then I'm attached individually to certain projects, right? So like gone the

[00:10:45] jock book or some of the Becky Clooney and Lisa, you know, to a low-tay book that we're just

[00:10:50] wrapping up now. And you know, I think they've announced some of the other ones like the White Boat

[00:10:55] the Scottsnighter, Francesco, Flankovia Book and Blood Brothers Mother that's Riso and Azarallo

[00:11:02] where we're with for years and a hundred bullets. So yeah, I'm working with them individually on

[00:11:06] those projects in just the same traditional kind of editorial way that I normally would. But then I

[00:11:12] also, yeah, I mean David and Chip and the rest of the team there. Like I have a lot of input or

[00:11:18] help on, you know, whatever sort of stuff like either is the people that they're talking to,

[00:11:24] is it, you know, previews stuff? Is it marketing kind of stuff? But you know, I don't know,

[00:11:31] I try not to, like I try to stay in my own lane as much as I can, you know, I mean I feel like

[00:11:36] they've done a great job of hiring, you know, people who do social media, people who do kind

[00:11:40] of the marketing and people do the production. Like I'm not, I've had a lot of success in my career

[00:11:45] taking over projects from other people, you know, like a hundred bullets or why the last man were

[00:11:50] books that I inherited essentially. And I think the smart thing that I did was kind of understanding

[00:11:56] what I was good at and then not feeling the need to put my fingerprints all over every single

[00:12:01] thing. Yeah, which is not, you can't say that I have a lot of, you know, necessarily all the people

[00:12:08] other editors that I work with over the years, other, you know, there is a tendency. You

[00:12:14] know, you see it all the time, you see it in sports, you see it in entertainment, you know,

[00:12:18] hire a new person in and then suddenly they got to like everything's got a change,

[00:12:21] they got to have their finger print, you know, like I definitely do not subscribe to that as a

[00:12:26] philosophy. So, you know, I was like, I'm not going to get in there and just be like, you know,

[00:12:32] you should be doing the Tic-Tac videos this way because I don't know anything about

[00:12:36] making Tic-Tac videos, but I do know a lot about making like kind of high quality

[00:12:41] pool genre comics that hopefully will, you know, stay on the test of time.

[00:12:47] So it's an interesting role, you know, like I don't even other projects and other people like they

[00:12:52] might talk to me, oh we're talking so and so, but they're, you know, or they may even send me pitches,

[00:12:57] you know, they might be getting in from new writers and stuff, but like say for instance,

[00:13:00] like something like Blast Feminist, which just premiered from America and Dolphoo,

[00:13:05] like they're not sending me the scripts for that, you know, like I'm not reading the script,

[00:13:09] I'm not seeing the stuff. I may see this, I mean they do a nice job of trying to create almost

[00:13:16] the vibe of like a virtual studio, you know, like there's what's that threads and other kind

[00:13:21] of communication stuff with everybody who's in the company, you know, creatively and internally.

[00:13:29] And so there's a lot of sharing of, you know, this thing just came in, you know,

[00:13:33] this covered this came in or this press release is going to go out or that, you know,

[00:13:37] that kind of stuff, at least you get the feel everybody feels, you know, because being freelancers

[00:13:41] is very isolating, right? Like they're very kind of off an island. So they have done a great job,

[00:13:47] I think, of trying to at least keep people in a loop and there's a lot of chatter back and forth.

[00:13:54] This and people don't participate at all, and some people would repeat this space a lot, you know,

[00:13:59] but it's, it is kind of a nice little, um, it's a nice to have these outlets for people to see

[00:14:05] stuff. But anyway, long story short, like, I'm not, I don't, like I'm not approving everything that

[00:14:09] goes, you know, out the door, so to speak, you know, but kind of an amazing, like little spot to be in

[00:14:17] there, you know? Yeah, it feels very fluid. Yeah, yeah, so I think if I'm not mistaken,

[00:14:23] Greg Lockhart is working as he's doing some editing stuff too.

[00:14:28] Yeah, I mean, he helped me on the devil's cup for sure. Okay. He might be, he works a lot with James

[00:14:36] on his stuff or image and like it's his sub stack and everything. Yeah. So I don't, he maybe,

[00:14:41] you know, doing some of that, um, you know, working on some of the books with James, like I'm not

[00:14:46] working on any of James's, you know, James's books, like he's got this whole tiny onion empire that,

[00:14:52] you know, sort of like they're packaging and bringing it all in kind of that way. So yeah,

[00:14:59] I assume Greg is and other people like that, you know? Yeah, is there, is there an ethos like an over,

[00:15:08] over arching one that like that you're kind of bringing in but just to some extent,

[00:15:12] I'm just kind of hearing you, you take a air traffic control for lack of a better way of putting

[00:15:18] it kind of kind of role where you let the people that you hired that are good, you hire the right

[00:15:23] people, you let them do their gig. So I mean, are you, is there, is there an imp, are you imparting,

[00:15:30] you know, kind of any imprint into the, you feel like into the DNA or is it just a okay,

[00:15:35] I'm trying to make and put out the best product, you know, here and that's my role.

[00:15:41] Yeah, I mean, I think that's always been my role is kind of, I mean, the real thing,

[00:15:46] the success I've had, I feel like is mostly based around

[00:15:51] its communication skills, it's like my interpersonal skill but it's also knowing what

[00:15:56] people need right? You know, it's like that everyone's different. I mean, one of the mistakes a

[00:16:00] lot of companies make a lot of, you know, places like a lot of editorial and I'll say, you know,

[00:16:06] Marvel editorial, DC editorial, you know, those sorts of things and they were making it while I

[00:16:11] was still there and I think they're still making a lot of these mistakes and you can see it in the

[00:16:15] end product really, is that when the only tool you have is a hammer like everything looks like a

[00:16:22] nail right? You know, so it's just like you're trying and we used to have this fight at DC all the

[00:16:27] time, like even the marketing sales people like, you know, selling Batman versus selling Greek

[00:16:33] street, like they're two very different things but you know there was one department, there was

[00:16:37] one group of people, there was one sales team, you know I'm nice to have huge fights with like can

[00:16:42] we just can we sit with these people? Can we come up with like talking points? Can we just meet the

[00:16:46] handful of retailers that we know are buying all this kind of mature creator own stuff? They're not

[00:16:52] the same ones who are buying 500 copies of being Titans, you know. So it was like trying to find

[00:16:59] that so I feel like, you know, that's been a fight for me forever than I've been having and

[00:17:04] you know much less so it's stillery obviously but because they really kind of understand, you know

[00:17:10] even within the company, the different books are selling to different audiences, they're selling

[00:17:14] the different retailers. They're being selling them in different ways, you know that sort of stuff but

[00:17:19] but yeah even editorial is speaking it's like for me it's just been like knowing,

[00:17:23] you know knowing what the person needs and try to helping them with that, you know some people

[00:17:28] really want like a lot of input and a lot of back and forth and a lot of, you know, and there's

[00:17:33] a lot of hair pulling and sort of you know that sort of thing I mean someone like a Scott Snyder

[00:17:39] like Scott is, you know he's doing like work at a super high level and he's like,

[00:17:43] you know top of the food chain and everything but you know he's definitely, and he's been doing it

[00:17:46] now a long time but he's still like he likes a lot of back and forth. He likes a lot of you know

[00:17:52] getting on the phone and talking it over and he's just talking and I'm just listening kind of stuff

[00:17:57] whereas you know I can work with guys like a Jeff Lameer or you know even like Ezrallo

[00:18:03] like they're just sending stuff in you know and then I and it's fully done and you know we might

[00:18:08] have a current conversation, we might not you know it's just like I mean you know we'll have a

[00:18:12] conversation but like you know there's not a lot of me by the time you get it it seems very fully

[00:18:17] formed and there's not they're not looking for a ton of input and they're not looking for a ton

[00:18:23] of feedback necessarily you know they're not they're not opposed to it but it's also you know

[00:18:28] it's just a different thing you know and that's true of artists too you know there's artists that

[00:18:33] want to send stuff in you want to go through every page or panel and then there's other people that

[00:18:39] you get the sense that they don't really need that or want that and then it's like trying to

[00:18:44] you know that doesn't mean you're not making changes you're asking for stuff like I'm always

[00:18:48] willing to ask like anybody for something if I feel it's necessary but um but even that you know

[00:18:54] I try to limit that kind of stuff as much as I can you know I mean my own ethos in that respect

[00:19:01] is just kind of always always this arbitrage of like what is getting what is asking for this change

[00:19:07] get me versus what is asking for this change lose me you know and I don't think a lot

[00:19:13] I don't I've not a lot of editors and work a lot of editors over the years and I don't think

[00:19:18] universal you know I think that there's a there's there's a philosophy that definitely

[00:19:24] exists that if I'm not asking for changes then I'm not doing my job you know um

[00:19:31] which is fair you know and if that's where you want it but I've never really

[00:19:35] subscribed to that like I've never approached it that way and at which I think then is reflected

[00:19:40] you know you getistically or whatever in the relationships that I've maintained over the years

[00:19:45] you know yeah um you know that I'm still working with people that I've worked with for 20 some

[00:19:50] years and working at a really high level and they're still doing what I think is their best work

[00:19:55] you know for me or with me it maybe even this sad it's even saying like doing it with me as

[00:20:01] opposed to for me you know sort of thing um which I think a lot of editors fall into this trap of

[00:20:08] you know that that's what editing is it's asking for changes it's you know it's

[00:20:13] you know putting your fingerprints on stuff it's you know in a lot of cases sadly it's like putting

[00:20:18] your boot on somebody's neck to get them to do it you know or threatening them or firing them

[00:20:24] I mean I can kind of one hand the people I've fired in my whole career and then nine times out of

[00:20:29] 10 and I don't even think there's been ten people I've had people come to me years later and be like

[00:20:34] you know what like that was the right thing to do if I wasn't ready or I was messing it up or

[00:20:40] I you know like I would have fired me too kind of like I've had that conversation over the years

[00:20:44] you know where I think a lot of other editors in different positions different places like that's

[00:20:50] their go-to you know move is like I'm gonna replace you or there's someone else that can do it

[00:20:56] like you know I don't think fear is generally a great motivator for like creative endeavors you know

[00:21:04] certainly not when you're in a big career out of doing what you're doing yeah like you know

[00:21:08] you don't want to be the ax man and that's your reputation that's that is not a

[00:21:12] yeah no right or just the person that's constantly you know like the churn and you see it I mean

[00:21:18] if you go look at other kinds of editors who can be doing a lot of time you know they might

[00:21:22] maintain certain relationships but you know it doesn't necessarily they go through these phases where

[00:21:29] they're working with the handful of people and then they're working with a new handful of people

[00:21:32] and you start to realize like oh that last handful of people like just didn't have enough you know what I mean

[00:21:38] yeah yeah for sure well we're in we're in a bit of a comics Renaissance right now

[00:21:44] and but I feel a lot of you know apprehension in the comics creative community there's

[00:21:50] I guess there's a lot of doubt as to where the wind industry is headed so kind of in your opinion

[00:21:56] as an industry veteran you know how do how do we write the ship how do we how do we build that

[00:22:02] foundation and move forward I guess and make people feel a little bit more positive about thing

[00:22:09] um yeah I mean that's a good question I don't I wish I had a good answer I mean some of it I

[00:22:15] don't really is a little baffling to me from this standpoint of it's a bit even like the greater

[00:22:20] culture particularly in the United States where it's like there's this sort of sense of you know

[00:22:26] gloom and sort of things but when you look at a lot of the traditional indicators of

[00:22:32] where things would be positive you know whether it's with like jobs you know the employment rates

[00:22:37] or inflation coming down or other things like that like we should be in a more positive mind state

[00:22:43] like on a traditional basis it feels like then we are and the same with comics in a lot of ways

[00:22:49] it's sort of like there's all this great material and it's been this like Renaissance and all

[00:22:53] this incredible stuff yet the storyline still tends to be oh you know like it's terrible

[00:23:02] where everyone's going out of business the sales are down you know all these sorts of things

[00:23:06] and it's like if you really drill down into a lot of the numbers and stuff like that's not necessarily

[00:23:11] the case and I don't but I don't know how you tone like the mood of everything you know around you

[00:23:18] you know because there's like a sort of an intellectual side to that but then there's also

[00:23:24] like an emotional side to that so I mean the only thing I would say about it and I've made my

[00:23:29] figure probably told the story before in other places but comics and I think comics specifically

[00:23:36] in my experience like based on other places and other issues I worked in we do have this

[00:23:42] propensity for like the skies falling kind of you know like like kind of like I think people have

[00:23:47] been predicting the death of comics since the first person drew a comic probably you know I mean

[00:23:51] even to the fact like so I started I started in vertigo in October of 1999 and I had been working

[00:23:58] in the film industry in New York City for like six or seven years before that maybe not quite

[00:24:03] that long five or six years and making like a lot of money and you know it's film so everything

[00:24:08] is amped up but it was also horrible right it like people were horrible the industry was I mean

[00:24:13] it was an exciting time it was the 90s it was like independent films blowing up its undance and

[00:24:19] everybody's you know going from rags to riches overnight and you know but like it wasn't a pleasant

[00:24:26] place to work you know just in terms of the way people treat each other and so when I went to

[00:24:31] work at DC in October I took a huge pay cap maybe I don't 75% pay cut or something like something

[00:24:38] really significant but I was just like I love comics and I love comics my whole life and it felt

[00:24:44] like something that I could you know maybe be good at in a career but literally two weeks after I

[00:24:50] started DC they had this all hands meeting and Paul Levitts and Jeanette Kern who was then the

[00:24:55] president like stood up and basically read off this list and you know here's all the books that

[00:25:01] are getting canceled here's all the stuff we don't know how long we're going to be able to

[00:25:05] continue with this rate we don't know any of this and it was like oh my god like I don't

[00:25:10] can I I don't know if I can swear on your podcast you know it's just like you know it's just like

[00:25:16] what I went home and talked to my wife and sitting at the kitchen table out like what the hell

[00:25:21] you know that I just do and she's saying to me like yeah what the hell did you do you know

[00:25:25] and it was just like the worst thing you could imagine you know to hear and I'm looking

[00:25:30] like I'm out of the meeting looking at Karen burger and Shelley Balon so if you'd hired me to be in like

[00:25:35] you know like what did you guys let me walk into here you know and that was in October of 1999

[00:25:41] you know so it's like here we are like literally 25 years later and we're sort of all freaking out

[00:25:46] about you know oh my god what's gonna happen you know um so I don't know so I wish I had the answer

[00:25:54] for why people feel this way but also you have to there is a like I don't know maybe this time

[00:26:01] it's different right I mean but but everybody thinks that always you know I mean there's

[00:26:06] there's there's uh you know they found profidian ancient Mesopotamian rumens that say

[00:26:13] you know kids these days have it so easy you know they don't understand how hard it was for me

[00:26:18] you know so it's like some of this stuff is you know it's always been that but yeah because I think

[00:26:24] if you really look at the good stuff that's happened I mean there is so much more opportunity for people

[00:26:30] people that traditionally haven't had opportunities I think get you know finding more space for

[00:26:35] opportunities you know there's more even I said this to people when they're talking about breaking

[00:26:40] into the industry it's like when I first started I mean it really you really did have to kind of

[00:26:45] convince vertigo or DC or marvel the higher you to be in the industry right even though there were

[00:26:51] small publishers you know at the time dark horse image other places like that like it still felt

[00:26:56] like you know you had to kind of have gatekeepers like myself included and knowing you that you were

[00:27:02] in the industry but it's like you don't really need that anymore you know it's like you know you

[00:27:06] have an idea and you have people and you know someone who can draw it and you can raise the fun

[00:27:10] than kickstarter and do it like paray you're in the industry you know welcome aboard you know so

[00:27:15] it's like you know there's that sense of like when everything is so flattened out or is on full now

[00:27:22] that it's some some of those old mindsets still persist I'm always surprised when I meet people

[00:27:28] at shows and they ask about and they're doing 10 different weird things and then they're talking

[00:27:31] about how do I break in I'm like you're in like I don't know what do you want me to say you know

[00:27:36] I mean if you're talking about how to get a job as marvel or DC well yeah I mean that's a different

[00:27:41] argument a different discussion but some of it is just this there is this very weird pervasive

[00:27:48] like imposter syndrome lack of self-confidence lack of and the permeates the entire industry it's not

[00:27:55] even just the people within it it's the way we even look at comics in the way we've traditionally

[00:27:59] looked at comics and you know that we're the sort of red headed stepchild of you know

[00:28:04] publishing and everything you know that and it certainly changed in the years that I've been in

[00:28:08] the business it's gotten a lot more um it's certainly gotten a lot more mainstream obviously you know

[00:28:15] with the rise of TV and movies and everything but yeah there was definitely a time early on in my

[00:28:19] career when people would ask me what I would do and it was like I work in publishing you know and

[00:28:23] it was just this weird sort of you know you had this kick almost of like not not saying that you

[00:28:30] added a comic books or something which seems I mean it seems embarrassing sounds stupid and hindsight

[00:28:35] but you know it is it is sort of uh it is very like in the DNA of our industry that we have this

[00:28:44] you know kind of lack of self-esteem almost yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah I mean that's

[00:28:51] societally pervasive I mean I remember from the music industry I try to tell people what I do

[00:28:55] and they're like okay what what and you say Rody and immediately that they get it but at the same

[00:29:01] little time it it calls to mine so many of these other you know preconceived things about it yeah right

[00:29:08] oh yeah no I had no idea when you said you worked in the music industry and then when say you're

[00:29:12] a Rody like in my own mind it's like a way so two trawly things exactly exactly not fair at all

[00:29:18] and it's like and I know for my own experience they can say like yeah well what a conflict editor does

[00:29:24] release what I think they do versus what you know probably people you know I always the people

[00:29:28] like oh so you correct the typos and the you know the grammar and stuff but I'm like well yeah but that's

[00:29:35] you know percent of what I do you know it's not you know not really the bulk of it but

[00:29:42] well yeah I mean I spent like 15 years really working with you know the biggest names and music

[00:29:48] you know and all these varied roles stage manager production manager down to like the guy

[00:29:53] driving the catering truck at times with my legs broken you know and I'm kind of curious about

[00:29:58] parallels between that what you do you know music I found anyway the big thing was was putting the work

[00:30:04] first and then frankly just having the balls to tell famous people what to do when when it came

[00:30:10] to that and I'm kind of assuming comics people are better behaved than musicians that's a low bar

[00:30:19] uh you know yeah spoken to a few editors at bigger publishing companies and it it seems like

[00:30:25] but you know that when you were talking about the management styles are very different it feels

[00:30:29] like they comics but you know how do you how do you do that how do you keep the big guns and liners

[00:30:36] it just a matter of okay Brian doesn't want that much whereas I know I need to communicate

[00:30:43] daily with Scott let's just say yeah yeah um yeah I mean you you are right I mean we jokingly

[00:30:50] had this added for years that there there are no comic book rock stars you know I mean I used to

[00:30:55] say to people all the time there's no such thing as a comic book rock star and there's no such

[00:31:00] thing as a comic book emergency you know like when people when either when people would start to

[00:31:05] get a little too big for their riches or when people really start to lose their shit over

[00:31:11] you know oh my god this book it's got this and it's like listen you know we're not

[00:31:15] this is not the ER we're not here in cancer here yeah yeah if you want to book to come out

[00:31:20] we need them to come out it's commercial publishing you got to chip at some point but yeah

[00:31:25] at a certain point like let's like everybody calm down you know like that like we're good like

[00:31:31] we'll fix this it's fixable whatever yeah and it's the same with the rock star thing I mean yeah

[00:31:37] probably who's the closer to a rock star we have Neil Gaiman maybe you know I mean it's like

[00:31:42] so weird thing in industry like the higher up the food chain you go

[00:31:46] like a Jim Lee right like Jim Lee should be like the Mick Jagger of comics in terms of just

[00:31:51] he's been around he's done everything he's like the man you know but if you meet like he's the

[00:31:56] night I mean yeah he's a businessman he can be cutthroat he can be very you know whatever I'm sure

[00:32:02] but he's also like the nicest like most chilled out friendly sort of person and he never

[00:32:08] like I've gone hung out with him when I have guys who are doing many comics that you know they print

[00:32:14] like in their basement along with you know Dave Gibbons and Brian Israel and Frank Miller or whoever

[00:32:21] and it's like they all get treated kind of the same you know I mean there isn't there really isn't

[00:32:26] a lot of huge egos in the industry and you know the people like for myself and the people I have

[00:32:33] come across it when I operate like that like it's generally like one off you know and then I'm like

[00:32:37] I don't want to who wants to deal with that stuff you know I mean you meet a guy like Jack who's

[00:32:40] like does it all now he's writing drawing doing all this stuff like you're not going to meet at

[00:32:45] nicer warmer more fun kind of just you know welcoming kind of person than that you know which

[00:32:52] is not true and like say the film industry and I'm sure oh I've got the music industry you know

[00:32:57] 100% yeah yeah so I mean which was a huge change for me when I came over I mean I'm I showed

[00:33:02] up the first day at a work in a suit and people just like mock me at these people were like yeah don't

[00:33:07] they're like lose the suit like no one wears suits and I was expecting a lot more of that kind

[00:33:12] of the yelling or the demanding stuff and you know I really by and large it's been very limited

[00:33:19] you know in my experience yeah over the years but yeah I mean I had to benefit at the moment

[00:33:25] anyway of having put in so much time with all these people that um I don't really you know I don't

[00:33:33] have awkwardness about like you know asking for stuff or asking for changes and that sort of thing

[00:33:38] but I can't really say that I ever have it's because as I said like there's really so few people

[00:33:43] that people that you feel like you have to you know defer to or worry about what they

[00:33:50] you know their expectation or worry about you know oh they're handlers like no I mean even in

[00:33:55] comics like the funniest thing like I mean I've always said this for years personally like

[00:34:00] I think my biggest skill is the kind of managing of the talent so if there were more money in

[00:34:05] the business like that's what I would do right like I would probably just stop um you know because

[00:34:13] the daily grind of editing comics can really kind of wear on you you know what I mean I mean it's

[00:34:17] I feel lucky that I have the job but the you know the the trafficking the pages and the

[00:34:23] you know the reading the stuff and getting it here and hitting the dead you know like if I could

[00:34:27] just kind of help creators you know what their ideas and manage their schedules and kind of

[00:34:33] picking shoes their projects better or that sort of stuff you know like what would like a manager

[00:34:38] like a business manager music manager kind of thing would do um I think I'd be really much

[00:34:45] I did you know that would really like lean into my skill set you know identifying new talent breaking

[00:34:51] new talent that sort of thing but yeah they're just generally isn't like enough you know money

[00:34:57] like you know you're not talking about these million dollar contracts that you could take like a

[00:35:02] 10% share of and you know live comfortably off a kind of thing so um yeah you know but because I

[00:35:09] do think I mean I think a lot of people in the industry would benefit from that for sure you

[00:35:13] know because I do find there's a lot of people that have a hard time um juggling all the stuff

[00:35:20] all the commitments getting the work done but then also just navigating the waters of you know

[00:35:26] kind of okay I'm gonna do this project if but this is going to be the one that I leverage to do

[00:35:31] this or you know whatever like I see I see so many people kind of you know staying kind of where

[00:35:38] they are and not advancing or they plateau at a certain point you know and it's like they're

[00:35:43] but it's like they kind of making the same mistakes over and over or just repeating the same work

[00:35:47] over and over and that sort of thing yeah like and I feel like they probably could use somebody to

[00:35:53] just like a little bit of a guiding hand or someone's even to kind of give advice to you know

[00:35:59] but which I do you know I feel like at this point I've earned the the respect of like my peers that

[00:36:06] they listen to me when I'm giving that kind of advice you know yeah 100% all right let's take a quick

[00:36:12] break what in the sand hill is happening right now what is that you like Bart oh you like band of

[00:36:25] Bart it's not my fault you muffle yeah that makes sense they're dropping some great new series right

[00:36:33] now there's that one about a heavy metal guitarist in the 1970s with monsters working class

[00:36:39] wizards you know how we love monsters around here and my friend Dakota Brown he's working on a project

[00:36:46] grandma tillies held tech mech with Lane Boyd I saw the preview for that that is crazy Jimmy even

[00:36:52] contributed to their anthology from this static and head Matt Sumo on the podcast to talk about his

[00:36:56] project the bardic verses which makes a lot of sense that the project landed there where can you

[00:37:04] find them you need to get out they were in previews or you can visit their website bandabars.com

[00:37:10] for all the latest can we turn the music off now oh thank you no more surprises menstruals

[00:37:18] or anything like that or I'll rinse you out to the rim fair as a children's ride let's get back

[00:37:23] to the show I am curious about with respect to distillery because right now you know it's big boys girls

[00:37:31] and non-binary folks who are you know who are up to the plate if you will and that makes perfect

[00:37:37] sense I mean as a new publisher and stuff but I'm trying to get a feel for future right and

[00:37:44] is the design to kind of keep the top people or is it going to be more of a thing where you're

[00:37:53] trying to break in some new stuff amount you know over time I'm just kind of longitudinally I'm

[00:37:59] trying to get an idea what yeah um yeah definitely more of the ladder for sure I mean

[00:38:05] you know the idea that you kind of you're establishing and our expectations you're you

[00:38:11] know meeting whatever kind of commitments we've made to investors and everything else you know

[00:38:16] I mean then starting off with the biggest talent you can get and the biggest names you can get

[00:38:21] you know certainly from a sales standpoint you know it's certainly helpful there so I mean that's

[00:38:26] the early stage plans but yeah long term there's definitely a sense of um I think one of the things

[00:38:34] that we've recognized or I recognize over the years and Mark Doyle my old associate at DC you

[00:38:40] you know runs side you W and stuff he had talked for years and really smartly so like you know

[00:38:46] industries like in the hip hop you know rap and you know that kind of music industry there's definitely

[00:38:51] that kind of mentor sort of bringing people along kind of thing that happens a lot right like you

[00:38:56] bring out somebody to do is you know like sing the hook on your song and then you're you know

[00:39:01] then you're producing their album and then you know just the fact that you put them on your record

[00:39:06] then that sort of you know thing to the audience like hey this person's like legit I don't think

[00:39:11] comics has done a great job of that sort of thing I mean I used to see it in certain you know

[00:39:16] little clicks and things but yeah that was definitely you know part of like the conversations

[00:39:20] early arms about like what you know once this initial batch of like heavy hitters kind of gets

[00:39:27] their turn at the plate it only makes sense that you're gonna then start casting a net that's

[00:39:33] a little wider but then also I think you know you know the sense of like an incubator kind of thing

[00:39:41] you know what I mean like where you're gonna not just but you know I I broke a lot of new talent at

[00:39:45] DC like if you go back and look at vertigo over the years like the people that I you know gave

[00:39:50] kind of their first significant work to whether it was like someone like jock or Jason Aaron

[00:39:55] or other people like that um but uh you know there was also though you're sort of at a certain point

[00:40:05] like they just kind of left them to sink or swim you know I mean not that I wasn't there to help

[00:40:10] them if they needed help but you know the at least the way the industry particularly companies

[00:40:13] like Marvel and DC it's like well then you're just dealing with other editors or in different

[00:40:17] departments like you kind of sink or swim you know based on that sort of thing but I think yeah

[00:40:23] I mean I think something where we're you know bringing stuff in bringing new people in new ideas in

[00:40:29] but also um you know really again like helping them kind of navigate you know all the waters here

[00:40:36] and whatever but I think you know by establishing certain expectations sales things

[00:40:42] early on like you know you have to have that foundation before you can really start to

[00:40:46] take flyers on on a lot of other you know I mean it's hard enough to get retailers and stuff

[00:40:51] on board with you know all the sort of aid listers you know so it's like yeah

[00:40:56] to turn around and be like oh yeah we have this 99 book from a whole team of people you never heard

[00:41:02] of you know like your reputation will carry a certain amount of weight but it only will get you

[00:41:07] so far you know I mean it's sort of point it's like a cash flow issue for people right so

[00:41:13] but yeah I mean I think it's any long term public any publisher that would be hoping to be around

[00:41:18] for a long time as these guys do I mean it has to be sort of part of your plan right you know

[00:41:23] I mean you have to and I feel like at least for me personally and I think that they share the same

[00:41:29] feeling it's like you kind of owe it like I've had an amazing run I've had an amazing life as a

[00:41:37] result I've met like incredible people you know I've done more traveled more than I would have

[00:41:43] ever dreamt of you know taking this job that I've got so it's like I feel like at a certain point

[00:41:48] like you've got to go back and you know try to you know I don't know what the like without signing

[00:41:57] totally corny about it like there has to be an aspect of your career or certain amount of time

[00:42:01] you set aside in your day that you're giving some of that back to somebody right like you have to

[00:42:07] be trying to find some it's not all just sales and profits and all the rest of that kind of stuff

[00:42:13] you know you have to sort of take on a more mentoring role and I think you have to start to move

[00:42:18] aside to let other people in right you know I mean I think that's probably we used to joke at DC

[00:42:23] like the only way to get promoted at DC was if somebody died basically you know like it was the

[00:42:28] only way you know which is a testament that it is a cool job and people did love the jobs and

[00:42:33] everybody's in these jobs does it a huge part of it is because you love it you know the medium and

[00:42:38] that and the industry you know not for the money like there's here you know I don't know anybody

[00:42:44] that got into comics for the money you know so it's so it's like yeah so I think a part of that too

[00:42:51] is like you have to be prepared or should be prepared or hoping moving yourself into a position where

[00:42:55] you're opening that door for newer people right you know like I think if you're going to evolve

[00:43:01] and change like it can't just be the same people you know like I still think of myself as kind of

[00:43:08] it's you know you still feel like you've kind of young or you would the way you'd look at older

[00:43:12] established people when you first started but like I've been that person now for a long time even

[00:43:17] though if I don't feel that way myself so it's like you know you kind of owe it to the next group

[00:43:22] of people that you know you're going to try to you know maybe make it a little easier for them

[00:43:27] or open a door for them or you know or even just get out of the way you know I don't mean

[00:43:32] yeah yeah I mean is there a is there a throttle control for you you know at this point in your

[00:43:38] life you know is there you know personal threshold of like okay now I'm I'm taking on too many

[00:43:42] things if you will yeah and it's only been recently though that I've sort of been even trying

[00:43:49] to deal with that I mean one of the biggest things for me going to be I mean I I almost wish that

[00:43:55] I wish there was like a work exchange program you know that like when freelancers could come and

[00:44:00] work in the offices for a month then you could go freelance for a month like when I was at vertigo

[00:44:05] like once I when I first left vertigo I was wishing that we'd had some kind of a work trade thing

[00:44:10] where you know I could have got a sense of what it was like to be a freelancer for even a week

[00:44:16] or something you know versus their expectation of what it was like the amount of stuff that they never

[00:44:22] saw that I had to do and deal with on a daily basis at a place like vertigo you know I mean the

[00:44:27] waters I had to navigate for on a daily basis versus you know the smart small amount of time that

[00:44:34] I had interacting with them as a freelancer but then vice versa it's like it's a lonely it's very

[00:44:39] lonely you know it's a lonely position it's a very difficult you know and the idea that like

[00:44:45] you would say no to stuff is it's tough like it really is hard to get to a point where you're saying

[00:44:50] no to things you know and I would say I mean I left DC in 2015 so I'm coming up it still feels

[00:44:57] very recent to me but like I'm coming up on 10 years now if like being out of you know on my own

[00:45:04] and it's really only been recently that I've you know actively like had to turn stuff down

[00:45:09] I mean I've turned things down that just like they couldn't pay me or there was nothing you know

[00:45:14] whatever but like to turn stuff down that I would really want to work on or that you know

[00:45:20] that I've just had to say no to just from really from a time kind of bandwidth standpoint yeah

[00:45:27] it's really been recently within maybe the last year and you know and even that might be pushing it

[00:45:32] it's just it's hard you know like I totally get it why all these freelancers end up over

[00:45:37] committing or saying yes because you just never know because you just get this fear that they're

[00:45:42] gonna stop calling you right so yeah but then you know but you said because in terms of human nature

[00:45:50] there's a lot of power in saying no right there's a lot of there's a lot of you know it's a

[00:45:55] difference between Veronica and Betty right you know I mean Veronica treats Archie like crap and

[00:46:00] he keeps coming back for more and Betty's always there you know to help them and you know

[00:46:05] and he neglects her you know like it's I mean it's I don't know it's just human nature but so

[00:46:11] but it's tough in the moment just be like yeah I don't think I want to do that you know because I know

[00:46:16] I'm gonna need more time you know but yeah I definitely I feel like there I have hit points where I'm

[00:46:22] over committed and I'm not living up to my own standards even you know it's a bit like running

[00:46:29] like a restaurant like I feel like as long as the people have front like don't really notice it then

[00:46:34] yeah you know that's ultimately okay yeah but I notice it internally and I can you know makes me

[00:46:39] feel bad that like there's definitely been times when I feel like I'm just I'm not phoning it in

[00:46:44] but there's definitely you know where I'm just feel like I'm not giving it the attention it deserves

[00:46:49] probably anyway if you don't see it as a reader or even if it's a creator you don't see it

[00:46:54] like it's my own internal clock like and you know it like you can smell it when you know

[00:47:01] when that's the thing so yeah it is um it is a challenge to try to figure out

[00:47:08] you know how to do that but again it's like yeah even the business of like oh I wish I could

[00:47:11] manage talent like I you know I wish I had a manager sometimes too yeah yeah I know exactly what

[00:47:18] you mean it's funny just to hear you talk about the about comics and and so many parallels with

[00:47:23] the music industry you know um even that statement just talking about like if the reader doesn't know

[00:47:29] yeah that is that is music in a nutshell because it's always a fiasco every single day

[00:47:35] but as long as the 40,000 people on the other side don't really notice it then your job is a success

[00:47:41] so yeah right yeah yeah I think I think the danger is just getting to the point where you stop

[00:47:49] that sort of self-analysis you know like I mean I think it's like you do the show and it's like

[00:47:53] you just feel like yeah like they'll eat whatever you put out for them you know I think that's

[00:47:58] I think that's where the danger starts to come in right and I think that's where the lack of quality

[00:48:02] or where you see it in bands that just kind of like they're just phoning it in you know it's like

[00:48:07] you just get to the point where it's like you know what's the difference you know like they're

[00:48:12] they're happy they didn't notice it like we messed up that stuff or we didn't play that song or

[00:48:17] you know it was the worst-win addition of that tune ever you know so I think but I think you have

[00:48:22] to constantly be kind and you know fight against that because it's too easy to just say

[00:48:28] okay sure you know like they'll buy it what's the difference you know like we know

[00:48:33] people like jack stuff it looks great like they'll buy it just get it out there you know

[00:48:38] yeah so yeah that's the thing that you're constantly fighting against

[00:48:41] that's the casino circuit and music by the way that that is always the marker right it's

[00:48:46] smash mouth or somebody else doing casino circuits don't ever get on those tours that is the worst

[00:48:52] experience you could possibly yeah I mean I feel like even these resonances and stuff you know

[00:48:56] it's just like I you know some of the people I know seem like even the YouTube stuff which has been like

[00:49:01] yeah it's okay you know like it's just you know but it's like you just get the sense of

[00:49:07] you know they're even the same in between every song pattern is the same you know it's not like

[00:49:12] there's nothing kind of you know improv- improvisation all about it or in that moment or that

[00:49:18] particular show it's like they're really just kind of painted by numbers you know yeah yeah let's

[00:49:23] look I don't I don't want to residents to get a Las Vegas casino you know where I can just do

[00:49:27] the same album like every but it's interesting because you would think that's the kind of case

[00:49:35] like it's not always the case because I even this is really in the weeds but like a few years ago

[00:49:39] they released that Elvis like all those recordings of Elvis and Las Vegas and he was literally doing

[00:49:44] two shows a night you know of like the same material like a dinner show and then like a midnight

[00:49:50] show and the amount of like differences in the versions and the amount of differences in the

[00:49:56] pattern with the audience and like just the the energy levels and stuff like in between not

[00:50:03] as daily shows but two shows a day like it's really like it was amazing like well at certain point

[00:50:08] like you listen to the same song like ten times like you pick a song you listen to them and then

[00:50:14] it's incredible to think that like you know if someone like an Elvis I think people would probably

[00:50:19] you know assuming he's just kind of going through the motions or whatever but like the dude must have

[00:50:24] really been like pretty driven because there's you hear so many differences and just the presentation

[00:50:31] and his energy levels and the sort of you know in the moment comments and pitter-patter with like

[00:50:38] the audience or with the singers and stuff yeah it's kind of interesting like that sort of stuff

[00:50:42] when he does a little in the weeds but no I actually want to ask you about like a unique kind of

[00:50:48] project because I was talking to Rom about a week ago about the one hand and six figures

[00:50:53] fingers which I thought was one heck of an ambitious idea so kind of what appealed to you about wanting

[00:51:00] to buy into that one yeah I mean I never it is ambitious and it was like I it's one of those

[00:51:09] things that when you hear the idea you're like how come there hasn't been more of this you know

[00:51:14] I don't want to say like it's never happened before maybe it's happened before if it has it

[00:51:18] I'm not exactly sure where you know what a what I would point to per se but yeah it was just the idea

[00:51:25] of that sort of thing like it's just such an interesting thing and and just the challenge of

[00:51:31] working on two projects that are related but also have to stand on their own you know

[00:51:39] is is definitely been like a challenge you know I mean because at first I was kind of like well you

[00:51:44] mean some of it is just literally continuity kind of stuff that you need to kind of keep track of

[00:51:50] but then some of it is just more kind of tonally or directionally that sort of thing

[00:51:57] and then it's even just the moving parts of like getting the books to come out in a certain

[00:52:00] sequence and all the rest you know yeah I know we even had big conversations recently about the

[00:52:05] collection like I hadn't really put a lot of thought into how it was being collected

[00:52:10] um and so yeah we're trying you know there's there's a lot of back and forth discussion about

[00:52:15] you know what's the best way to collect them for the reading experience but also from a sales

[00:52:20] standpoint and all the rest you know um but yeah I mean it's it's pretty ambitious and I mean

[00:52:27] think we've had a pretty long runway for it so um it's not the kind of thing that I would want

[00:52:32] to be doing on like really short notice you know I mean we've been working out for a couple of

[00:52:36] years now I would say you know we're like a lot of the issues in the can and everything um but

[00:52:43] yeah it's smart I mean Ram is like really I mean he's one of the smartest I mean you know people

[00:52:48] in the industry in terms of just managing his managing his stuff and managing his career and the

[00:52:54] decisions he's made and things like that and um and beyond just being super creative um

[00:53:00] and you know he's got a little bit of a team of you know the people who work with him on other

[00:53:04] books and stuff so there's a coherent vibe to the two projects you know even though they're

[00:53:11] sort of you know you could read either one on its own get like a really hopefully satisfying experience.

[00:53:17] Yeah well this is my totally random question so you'll have to forgive me here before we wrap up um

[00:53:23] in my former life I was a professional landscape photographer that's before

[00:53:27] but it's permanently shut the door for that um it's been a lot of time in the finger lakes region

[00:53:32] like teaching photography workshops and my son has his sights actually set on Cornell

[00:53:37] so in an area known for its waterfalls and it's kind of a native yourself what's your

[00:53:41] what's your favorite spot to get outside in the finger lakes region.

[00:53:45] Oh that's good that's a good one because yeah I worked all my teenage years in the in the

[00:53:50] New York state uh parks you know up there like I didn't know I grew up you know yeah well yeah

[00:53:56] I grew up in Etcica so I grew up in you know so yeah I worked at Tremin I worked at Butter

[00:54:00] Milk these are like all the parks around Etcica um yeah so it's been a lot of time you know outdoors

[00:54:08] I mean in that area I mean it's tricky like there's the biggies like Watkins Glen is kind of the big

[00:54:15] you know like you you want the real you want the big bombastic like Vegas kind of experience

[00:54:21] and you know Watkins Glen is like really like probably the one that most people point to but yeah

[00:54:26] there's some really really smaller ones like the Tremin has like a swimming hole where there's the

[00:54:32] waterfall that you can climb behind on the rocks you know which is a nice little touch and then

[00:54:39] there's a trail an upper buttermilk falls that's like just that was kind of my personal favorite

[00:54:43] my wife and I when we first were married living there had a dog like that was the one

[00:54:48] you know it's a lot of steps and I don't know nowadays I mean I was a much younger man then but like

[00:54:53] you know it's um it's you know that the trail that takes you from like lower buttermilk to upper

[00:55:00] buttermilk it's just you know it's pool after pool of like this just crystal clear like whole water

[00:55:07] and you know I suppose to swim in it but of course everybody does yeah I grew up my entire life

[00:55:11] like you know young life swimming in all the gorges and you know all the crazy stuff like we

[00:55:17] stand those like to try to swim as early in the season as you can so you go to like Ethica Falls or

[00:55:22] other places of jump in and like you know the sort of polar bear club and that kind of stuff but

[00:55:28] yeah I mean it's a I mean it's like one of the most beautiful places I've been

[00:55:33] I've been fortunate to travel over but it's you know anytime I'm back up there I'm always just

[00:55:38] like oh it's just incredible up here like the hills and the vineyards and you know all the things but

[00:55:43] yeah it's it's amazing pocket of I mean I just love love the area my one fun story was

[00:55:52] driving one by one night and there was a you know white deer right behind the fence and

[00:55:57] and it was just like ethereal and spooky and that was before I knew about the white deer population

[00:56:02] that's there on the armory so right that freak my shit that was wild yeah that is pretty

[00:56:11] that is pretty crazy but yeah you know it's it is it is just amazing country up there that's for sure

[00:56:18] you know so but yeah I spent a lot of time as a kid and then working in all those parks like

[00:56:24] you know like as a teenager it's really cool yeah it's okay anything that it's new that's

[00:56:31] dropping that you're personally working on you you want to give a little pitch to you before we go

[00:56:35] um yeah I mean we're trying to wrap up the first couple of distillery series like gone like

[00:56:41] gone three and some of the three like you know um put those to bed so those first couple

[00:56:47] series are you know wrapped up which is great I mean you mentioned that one hand in the six

[00:56:51] fingers I think six fingers number one just came out today right yeah this week yeah yeah so

[00:56:58] yeah I mean if people want to look into that I mean it's just those books are great you know

[00:57:02] Dan Waters wrote that one and um you know working with Ram and the other one yeah and then I think

[00:57:09] we've already announced like some of the next books in the in the distillery way if you know there's

[00:57:13] the Scott Snyder white boat with Francesco Frankavia you know working Batman and did night of

[00:57:19] the ghoul with me together and and then of course the the blood brother's mother which is the

[00:57:24] western that Ezrallo and Riso or Eduardo Riso are doing which just looks incredible like Brian

[00:57:30] and I yesterday you went over the first issue like all the corrections on the first issue the lettering

[00:57:35] in this like every page we were just marveling at it like you know that look what a master like

[00:57:41] Eduardo is at comic book storytelling you know yeah the choices he makes and the things that he puts

[00:57:47] in and the things that he leaves out like it's just just every page is like a master class you know

[00:57:52] um so yeah and it's still it's good that you know we both of us the two of us were like this is

[00:57:57] just awesome like these pages is so good you know and then you can work with people you've worked

[00:58:01] with for 25 years and still see them pushing themselves to that let you know to do it at such a

[00:58:09] high level yeah that is definitely um you know makes me you know get out of bed and like for sure

[00:58:17] I feel very fortunate in that respect well where can people find you online do you want them to

[00:58:23] find you online these these days right do they want me to find anyone to find me online um yeah I

[00:58:29] mean I have a I do have a website that's mostly just you know kind of yeah like stuff I worked on

[00:58:35] in things um bespoke comics.com which is you know a little bit like cheeky cheekily named but um

[00:58:44] yeah and I'm an Instagram it's like really OD on Instagram if you want to see but mostly it's

[00:58:51] just me my other big hang up in my other big obsession is like always been like Warhammer you know

[00:58:57] gain foretrap stuff yeah so uh that's like my hidden my secret chain so really my Instagram is mostly

[00:59:05] it's mostly mostly posts of me like you know yeah like you know models that I've painted

[00:59:13] poorly you know that sort of stuff so but yeah that's the only one I'm on I'm not

[00:59:19] equipped Twitter years ago I don't good for you kind of Facebook and you know yeah yeah that was the

[00:59:26] best decision I ever made I can't recommend it more highly um but yeah so Instagram's only one

[00:59:32] I'm Instagram's okay it seems like people are generally a little nicer feels like and it doesn't

[00:59:39] feel quite as like toxic as those other ones felt you know yeah but I try to limit the time as much

[00:59:44] as I can no one wants to hear from this like old dude about you know painting is 28 millimeter

[00:59:52] the space murning good on yeah I don't I'm almost 49 almost 50 I can't imagine like my eyes for

[01:00:02] hours sitting there with the brush and pulling that you know believe me yeah no no I can't imagine

[01:00:10] either but yeah you just get like some magnifying glasses or whatever like that's about all like

[01:00:16] two and they're done to what you'd call like a table ready to stay and stand there's not a you know

[01:00:23] yeah you're not gonna put them in anybody's case or put them up for a painting contest but

[01:00:27] it is better now it's fun and Stephanie I love all the the lore and just the world of it and everything

[01:00:33] and the community is a little toxic at times I don't really deal with a lot of the

[01:00:38] you know stuff it's really just more the hobby side of it but it it it's kind of fun particularly

[01:00:42] living in the northeast you know like like 15 degrees out now so yeah you know like last night

[01:00:48] I definitely was like yeah I could just sit up here and put her around for an hour or two let's

[01:00:53] go podcast like yours and you know it's all good it's relaxing something different you know

[01:00:59] and it's not looking at a screen too that's a big part of it for me is that you know

[01:01:03] yeah it wasn't involved screens which I appreciate yeah I can't do screens at night at all

[01:01:08] I can't sleep afterwards I feel like such an old man so I can barely sleep I've never slept

[01:01:14] like ever like even since I like I can't sleep but my sleep habits are parable and I know

[01:01:19] everyone else sleep you gotta get sleep whatever but like they've always been terrible so

[01:01:23] I don't worry about it so much like it isn't like a recent development that I would run to a doctor

[01:01:28] and say it's just been like this since I was like a teenager younger you know even when I was a

[01:01:33] little kid my parents used to let me stay up like after they went to bed you know like whatever but

[01:01:39] just the way it is but yeah but yeah it's fun you know you got I think everyone should have hobbies

[01:01:45] you know yeah are there are there still games workshop shops yeah yeah yeah yeah there's still one

[01:01:54] in the York I mean in the city it's on eighth street been there forever and I'm up in Connecticut

[01:01:59] now but like maybe 90 miles from the city or something but yeah there's one over here in like heart

[01:02:04] in West Hartford that you can go to it's like maybe an hour and change but um so yeah any excuse

[01:02:12] that can find yeah even this weekend I think we're taking a little trip like to the birchers for

[01:02:16] like a vacate you know like a little like just a weekend thing and I'm yeah I'm always I'm always

[01:02:22] looking at the google maps and like searching out you know happy shops in the area and stuff like

[01:02:28] that luckily they mostly tend to turn out to be like you know RV car or hobby shop so I don't

[01:02:35] you know I don't have to go to one or drag my wife to them but yeah there's still there's still

[01:02:39] and anytime I go to the thought bubble like in the UK which is a fantastic convention yeah

[01:02:45] with the best conventions you can go to but like the method to my madness is that in in the UK like

[01:02:52] there's a games workshop on every corner you know right and it's like it's such a bigger part of

[01:02:57] the culture there that yeah you can visit all these different ones and so yeah that's always a big

[01:03:03] part of my any trip I take over there so planning around little nerd action yeah exactly go a day

[01:03:10] early and hit like two or three of them you know that's good we all gonna have our things

[01:03:15] yeah no exactly you gotta have something and it's tricky you know I grew up loving comics

[01:03:19] reading comics and it's the one big downside to my whole career has been you know when one of

[01:03:25] your passions like turns into your job yeah it's definitely like a minefield you know I mean people

[01:03:32] always think I think people think it's like oh I want to turn my passion into a job and it's

[01:03:37] cool but it's also like it's a double-edged sword you know yeah probably probably no better than

[01:03:43] the most like that was yeah music industry and it bit me and I did it you know for 15 years

[01:03:49] and you know it was in my mid-20s and I saw the writing on the wall like all my friends who were

[01:03:54] 40 and yeah it's just a it's just rough yeah so I was like I need an out so dropped out of

[01:04:02] yeah yeah yeah dropped out of me like double major anthropology and environmental science

[01:04:07] and the rest is history nice yeah all right it's good if you're happy that's all it matter exactly

[01:04:16] yeah and I mean happiness is one of those things you have to go you have to go find happiness like

[01:04:20] I don't think yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah all right well well thanks for joining me today on the

[01:04:27] show best of luck with future endeavors oh thanks I appreciate it to appreciate the time for

[01:04:33] the invitations thanks to you yeah all right yeah this is biono niel on behalf of all the

[01:04:40] sitcom book getty thanks for tuning in and we'll see you next time take care everybody

[01:04:44] this is biono niel one of your hosts of the cryptic creator corner brought to you by comic book

[01:04:49] getty we hope you've enjoyed this episode of our podcast please rate, review, subscribe,

[01:04:55] all that good stuff it lets us know how we're doing and more importantly how we can improve thanks

[01:05:01] for listening if you enjoyed this episode of the cryptid creator corner maybe you would enjoy our

[01:05:08] sister podcast into the comics Kate listen and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts